Which to buy: McLux III PD vs Aelph 2?

Reason for Edit: I pretty much decided that I don't need the Son of RAW and the discussion in this thread has moved to considering purchasing the McLux III PD or the Aelph 2. All input appreciated.

So far I have purchased a QuickSilver V and I have a JIL Intelli on order. As an almost Flashaholic I want lots of other flashlights. I am just about to send payment for a Son of RAW. Are the JIL Intelli and Son of RAW similar enough flashlights that I should be rationalizing some other flashlight instead of the Son of RAW? All opinions are welcome! Thanks.

Re: Does a Flashaholic Need a JIL Intelli & SOR?

Ned-L said:

So far I have purchased a QuickSilver V and I have a JIL Intelli on order. As an almost Flashaholic I want lots of other flashlights. I am just about to send payment for a Son of RAW. Are the JIL Intelli and Son of RAW similar enough flashlights that I should be rationalizing some other flashlight instead of the Son of RAW? All opinions are welcome! Thanks.

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I would agree with you if your budget is limited. Then go for the next level up in throw like an Aleph1 or 3 or many other light choices.

My Jil DD rev2 with self modded upgraded reflector is my EDC and fave light. I get about 600 LUX on a regular primary battery and over 1000 LUX with a LiON. But my RAW UYOJ gets 1600 LUX then again my Aleph1 gets 3500 LUX and A3 gets 5500 LUX although the Alephs use a Tbin NG1000 But all lights are single cell battery lights. The spread of throw between all these variations is 50yards! Since the lowest throws about 20yards and highest throws about 70yards.

How about going for a flood type reflector or single cell light like a Mclux or an A19 or the the PD. Holy cow do I like McGizmo's lights or what! I'm not trying to say buy his lights. Just trying to show you that there are many different distinctions. Like throw vs flood, single cell vs multi, runtime vs size, LED vs incan, Custom vs store bought etc etc.

Yes the RAW/Jil thing are similar enough that if you dont have the resources and you're a flashaholic, meaning you dont need the light for anything specific then just get the Jil because it's HA3 and makes a great EDC. I actually EDC one or the other because I like both.


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Re: Does a Flashaholic Need a JIL Intelli & SOR?

CroMagNet, Thanks for the great reply. Glad to hear that you EDC your JIL DD. Although I don't have the JIL Intelli yet, it seems to me to be about the perfect EDC light. The Son of RAW is really an interesting light and would be more for the novelty of having another cool, powerful, small light, but I bet I would still EDC the JIL. So could you provide some insight between the McLux and Aleph lights? I was considering the McLux III PD (I think that is the model) as an EDC light. After deciding on and getting the JIL Intelli as an EDC, I think the next category I would be interested in is still LED, larger than JIL but still pocketable (at least in casual pants), and more powerful. Keeping in the $200 range what are your thoughts? I will also go look at some of your other threads. I see that you have posted some useful information on some of these lights.

Re: Does a Flashaholic Need a JIL Intelli & SOR?

Ned-L said:

CroMagNet, Thanks for the great reply. Glad to hear that you EDC your JIL DD. Although I don't have the JIL Intelli yet, it seems to me to be about the perfect EDC light. The Son of RAW is really an interesting light and would be more for the novelty of having another cool, powerful, small light, but I bet I would still EDC the JIL. So could you provide some insight between the McLux and Aleph lights? I was considering the McLux III PD (I think that is the model) as an EDC light. After deciding on and getting the JIL Intelli as an EDC, I think the next category I would be interested in is still LED, larger than JIL but still pocketable (at least in casual pants), and more powerful. Keeping in the $200 range what are your thoughts? I will also go look at some of your other threads. I see that you have posted some useful information on some of these lights.

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The PD is a great light. I would definately recommend it for your next light. After buying it you will measure all lights to it as a benchmark. Bogus1 is selling an Awesome version of one right now and I highly recommend it for you since you have been thinking of it anyway. It's also a Ubin!


57. Black mint U bin PD with the new style Ti clip and tritium. This light is in mint condition. moeman worked on the threads and they are very silky. I am asking $235 and will include a Ti bezel for $265 if desired.
Here's the LINK
In a PM, I asked him to reserve it for you until you read this post and decide, Not sure if he will though

You can take a look at my A19 link in my sigline for some idea of what it might perform like as I think the reflector is similar but the Ubin is being driven differently that my 5W BB400. Either way, it's a great find. You can also check the Sandwich Shoppe for more choices of all McLights in production.

As for the Alephs, it's a great series of lights and there is a lot of info to read in the mcGizmo section on CPF and it's all documented really well. I like it because you get the highest quality light that is versatile by getting other heads, reflectors, tails, LE's etc for the needs of the owner.

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Re: Does a Flashaholic Need a JIL Intelli & SOR?

CromagNet, thanks for the McLux III PD recommendation and thanks to Bogus1 for putting it on hold. I have two questions before I let Bogus1 know if I want the light. First an easy question before my long question. What is the highest (mah) rated rechargeable battery that is recommended for use with the McLuxIII PD and who sells it (AW?)?

Now for the longer question - being new to this, I was wondering what are the advantages and downsides of buying a used light (does it come with a warranty of any kind to begin with and if so does it transfer?); I see that the current prices from McGizmo directly are:
At present, following versions offered:

McLux III-PD HA-dark slate (Black) - $205 (TY0J) or (TW0J)
McLux III-PD HA-Nat -$210 (TY0J) or (TW0J)

Optional upgrades (shown on black PD) to the base lights above:
H3 vial in piston (subject to limited availabliity) - $25
New Style Ti clip - $10
Ti Bezel Ring (subject to limited availablity) -$30
It looks like the new equivalent except for the U bin is $270 versus used at $265. I saw another thread where someone asked McGizmo if it was worth modifying the light to put in a U bin and he said that it was not enough of a difference to be worth it. I suppose I could offer Bogus1 something less, but not sure if that is done and I don't have any idea what is fair.

Any further recommendations? Thanks.

Re: Does a Flashaholic Need a JIL Intelli & SOR?

Those are good questions and I hope you PM'd them to Bogus1 so he can answer.

Your research regarding the value is good. You get the same light for a bit less but with a Ubin which may have more output.

Picking either way would not be a mistake IMHO.

I would like to know what is the full bin code of the Ubin ie tint and vf forward voltage and at what mA is it running the LED. It would be awesome if you could run it with a Single LiON 4.2V from AW but would still be nice if you got a rechargable 3.0V NiHM.

Let me know the answers and your decision. Either way it's a good one. There's a popularity thread going around about the 2005 light of the year and the PD is in 3rd or 4th place IIRC besting even my beloved Jil DD UP. I'm sure the price keeps more people from seeing the PD to get it more votes.

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Re: Does a Flashaholic Need a JIL Intelli & SOR?

No...... i don't

but a flashaholic does need an eternal light and a fenix!!

Re: Does a Flashaholic Need a JIL Intelli & SOR?

I took your advice and just PM'd Bogus1. In the meantime as long as you have been so helpful (thanks), why would or how would you choose either a McLux III PD or an Aelph 2 like this one currently on sale at the Sandwich Shoppe, reg. $193 on sale for $173.70:


The Aleph 2 (20mm) 1X123 Flashlight consists of a Aleph 2(20mm) head with a Nexgen 750 Light Engine, a 1X123 power and a 15 ohm McE2S Trim tailcap 2-stage switch. Color:Natural; LuxIII TX1J

or any of the other Aelph 2s (or other model Aelphs like the Aleph 1(27mm) 1X123 Flashlight consists of a Aleph 1 (27mm) head with a Nexgen 750 Light Engine, a 1X123 power and a 15 ohm McE2S tailcap 2-stage switch; Color: Black LED: Lux III UX1K for $189.90) for instance that are almost all cheaper than a McLux III PD? Are the Aelph 1 and McLux III PD both small enough to EDC? If not are they reasonably comfortable to carry in your pants pocket but just a little too big to EDC?


And a more fundamental question: other than wanting a light like this because of the flashaholic sydrome (or disease), how do you or most flashaholics you know use such a light? FYI: I am a runner and mountain biker and use an Inova X5 all the time for running at night or when walking the dog. I am going to supplement a Niterider Halogen light on my helmut with the Quicksilver V (VB16 5W) mounted on my handlebars (when the twofish cycloblock arrives).



Thanks, Ned

CromagNet said:

Those are good questions and I hope you PM'd them to Bogus1 so he can answer.

Your research regarding the value is good. You get the same light for a bit less but with a Ubin which may have more output.

Picking either way would not be a mistake IMHO.

I would like to know what is the full bin code of the Ubin ie tint and vf forward voltage and at what mA is it running the LED. It would be awesome if you could run it with a Single LiON 4.2V from AW but would still be nice if you got a rechargable 3.0V NiHM.

Let me know the answers and your decision. Either way it's a good one. There's a popularity thread going around about the 2005 light of the year and the PD is in 3rd or 4th place IIRC besting even my beloved Jil DD UP. I'm sure the price keeps more people from seeing the PD to get it more votes.

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Re: Does a Flashaholic Need a JIL Intelli & SOR?

Hi NED! Glad you're having fun

Once again an excellent progression of questions, some of which I cant answer, however, most of your questions are pretty much answered in the McLux PD FAQ including the size comparison directly to an A2 and even options for carrying with pictures showing the light in a front pocket! There's even a Jil 1.3 in a picture!

The differences that come to mind, other than the basic designs are completely different, with the PD not using the body to transmit current and the heat sink being directly on the PD head. The Aleph uses a Light engine and the whole concept of the light is modular. All the components are interchangable for different effective uses such as throw or flood or runtime and size etc. I think they're even interchangable with Surefire lights.

The A2 was the floodiest :thinking: head/reflector of the Aleph series until the A19 came along. The A2 that I have has +/- 2500 LUX and while the A19 is much less it is pretty much a nice wall of light to about 40ft or so.

The usage seems to come down to the reflector and the PD FAQ says it has a MCR-20.

Here's a quote from the Reflector FAQ
McR-20: This was the first production reflector I had made based on a focal length and curve I devised and initially visited in smple 17 and 35 mm configurations. I opted for the 20 mm as I felt it was the maximum size reflector that could be used in a 1" OD head. The first light to use this reflector was the Aleph 2. It is also being used now in my McLuxIII-PD.

Since they have the same reflector you'd think they'd have the same performance. Since I dont have a PD yet, I'll have to sit this part out. Maybe someone else, who has both can add to this or you can try a new thread with the specific question.

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Re: Does a Flashaholic Need a JIL Intelli & SOR?

I just went outside to test my A2 NG1000 3W and the A19 BB400 5W

Since 5W LEDs make more of a flood and 3W are more for throw I swapped the LEDs to see what would happen. The A19 with a 3W was still a big wall of flood with a slightly brighter spot and the A2 with a 5W still had a pronounced hotspot. So the reflectors were doing what I figured.

When I pointed the A2 3W at an area under a shrub some 90ft away, you could still clearly see what was there although it was at the edge of its throwing efficacy. How's that for using an electronics word for an artsy non electronics guy.


The A19 couldn't expose the area below the shrub for 90ft or even 60ft but when I walked across the street I could light up the whole front of the house from 90ft away and even clearly read the address numbers on the door, which really surprised me.

I think the PD would behave more like the A2 but I think they run them around 750mA so a Ubin PD might be similar to my TWOK NG1000 A2

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Re: Does a Flashaholic Need a JIL Intelli & SOR?

Thanks again for the info. Yeah, I was a little surprised to see that you had such an extensive, cool list of flashlights but no McLux III PD. I though maybe you just hadn't updated your listing (by the way, where in your user profile or whatever do you create the listing of your lights to display at the bottom of your posts?).

Thanks for doing the comparison at what about midnight your time (somehow I am guessing that you don't mind finding a reason to use and compare lights). "throwing efficacy" - I don't think I have seen that used before on CPF - but it works, not bad!

I find that there is an overwhelming amount of information on the McLux III PD and from my non-technical perspective, the technology seems very impressive. However, I have not yet found a similar level of detail describing the Aelph's. For instance, the Aleph 2(20mm) head with a Nexgen 750 Light Engine, a 1X123 power and a 15 ohm McE2S Trim tailcap 2-stage switch. Color:Natural; LuxIII TX1J that I mentioned in my previous post. What is a Nexgen 750 Light Engine and how does that compare to the technology of the PD? I assume that a 2-stage switch means that there are two light levels, but what are the levels and how about runtimes at the different levels. I have read lots of stuff about not exceeding the voltage on lights and sometimes it will ruin it and sometimes not, what about the A2? So I am leaning towards the PD because of the design, look, technology coolness factor. Now you have me thinking about throw versus flood. This is a bad disease! So what is a great 1 cell light up the room/wall kind of light?

Thanks

Ned

Re: Does a Flashaholic Need a JIL Intelli & SOR?

Again, all great questions and you'll have to read a bunch more to get up on it all. The PD and A2 will basicaly do the same thing. I think both have a two stage switch to extend the runtime and the runtime should also be very similar. It's interesting now that we've looked at these two comparisons together, how similar the two are!

A NexGen 750 is a sandwich circuit that makes the light run at 750mA. It is one of the most efficient ones and one of the most efficient drives for LEDs. You can see them at the Shoppe too.

I have a very busy day today and this evening as well so I probably wont get to post for a while. I recommend you change the title of your first post to read something like "McLux III PD vs Aleph2 ????" because I think many people who have them are not getting to read this thread and it would help to have more input from other CPF'rs.

Again, Welcome to CPF!

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Forgot to mention that you need to BUMP your thread so it goes back to the top for all to see.


Bump

How do you bump a thread?

Good info. I've been wanting one of Don's creations and have been going back-forth on this myself. In my case, I'm partial to the E-series compatibility so it's likely an Aleph 2.

I have a McLux PD and an Aleph 2. I prefer the McLux for a few reasons. I like that the twist action was moved to the front of the flashlight (PD). It makes the light easier to turn on with one hand. I like that the PD uses...what I will call an insert (aka- piston) for current flow. This makes managing the threads less important. What this means is in most LED flashlights you have to maintain the threads so current will transfer throught the light and not cause the LED to blink, dim, basically act funny. I find the PD is a lot easier to maintain for me. Additionally, I think the Aleph series may use a more dimpled reflector because it does not throw as far as my PD. However, the PD has a hole in the beam when using less than 6 inches from an obect. Where as the Aleph does not show a hole until 2-3 inches from an object. However, I prefer the PD beam and that trade off. I should mention that the PD regulates on both low and high, where the Aleph just regulates on high and resistors for low.

You may want to check out the Chameleon that Mr Bulk is making or the LionCub. I have the LionCub and love it.

I also think you will love your JiL Inteli (is that what it is called?). I have the same setup but in a 1.3 JiL version Goldserve made. It is awesome. I am waiting for the FF (firefly) 3 to come out. I really like twisties that twist at the head because one hand operation is easier.

FYI- I found that a reflector makes a bigger difference than the amount of light due to the trade off of heat and shorter runtime. At least for me. I will give you an example. An Aleph 3 at 500ma is better for me than an Aleph2 at 750ma.

I am not going to proof read this because I am lazy, so any errors ignore and anything that does not make sense just ask for clarification.

Good Luck,
rob

Ned-L said:

How do you bump a thread?

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The forum sorts the threads (this may be a user setting) by the thread that has the most recent reply. So when someone says bump, they mean reply to a thread and it will be listed first. That is, more people will see it.

Make sense?


rob

If yu wanna compare the McLuxIII-PD vs the Aleph System ... here are some of the main differences:

- The Aleph system is modular and fully compatible with teh SF E-Series platform, meaning you can play light-LEGO and change configurations in a heartbeat ... whereas the PD is a stand-alone light

- The Aleph System uses so -called LEs (light engines" that can be swapped netween the heads to further enhance modularity and they allow for an upgrade of your light when the flow of time has "obsoleted" your current LEDs ... whereas the PD is a fixed combo

- the PD is sturdier and heavier

- the PD is technologically more advances as it offers 2 fully regulated levels of light whereas the Aleph's low is unregulated

- the PD is mechanically more advanced and has the perfect electrical path, sapphire window, ... as it is the successor to the Aleph Series

- the PD has a clip, the Aleph not (in standard configuration at least that is)


Generally speaking, the PD is a more advanced package but is much simpler to use ... you can swap in a Li-Ion or a CR123 and just use it, that's all ... whereas the Aleph System requires a good deal of thinking before you can order one or play LEGO ... as there are zillions of options including drivers, LEDs, dive currents, battery configurations, ... you name it.

The Aleph System offers zillions of choices but requires an experienced user, or one that is willing to invest some thought in his lights.

If you wanna know more about the Aleph System and the modularity it offers go to the McGizmo forum and check out the sticky threads ... where a, Aleph FAQ and modular parts thread is linked.

If you have any further question, don't hesitate to ask.

BTW ... performance-wise an ALeph2 / 1x123 / NG500 / 15ohms comes realitively close to the PD. The PD isn't a scorcher pocket rocket, it is a very reasonable tool. It will be quite brighter than a JIL 1.3 or a QIII though.

bernie

Bernie,

Thanks - that was very informative. I decided to get a McLux III PD. For future reference, could you point me to the Aleph FAQ. I thought that I looked pretty carefully and did not come across any information as detailed as what I found on the McLux III PD FAQ.

Ned

Good choice Ned ! I've had my PD for a few weeks and couldn't be happier.