Just got a WE Boxer 24W HID...

...and I'm a little disappointed?

It's me first ever HID, which I bought from a fellow member on the MP (great deal for it too ). Arrived in the mail recently, and after charging it up a little, I fired it up and though WOW that's bright . Brought out my M6 and was surprised to see that there really wasn't that much difference in terms of output between the lights, despite the M6 being rated 500 lumens and the Boxer 1800. I also happen to have a Solarforce L1200 rated at 1200 lumens (though more like 900 lm.) and they was roughly equal in terms of output.

Took the L1200 and the Boxer out for a walk in the countryside tonight, and learnt why people usually prefer the 4300K HIDs as opposed to the 6000K bulb in the Boxer. The boxer had ever so slightly more throw, but the incan beam was just so nice for walking out in the woods, especially against the slightly ghostly blue tint of the Boxer.

For now then, i'm still very much an incan guy, though i'm hoping someone here will try to convince me otherwise? Was really looking for this light to stomp everything else I had in terms of output, but it didn't. In fact I think the el cheapo Solarforce (~$100) had even higher output than the boxer. Do HID bulbs lose brightness over the course of their life? Since I bought the light second hand, that might be the case that i'm not seing it at full brightness, or could it just be that I was expecting too much?

First of all, congrats on the new light!:twothumbs

No, HID bulbs actually get brighter with usage as they get "broken in".

You might want to consider the AmondoTech N30 HID as it is 30 watts at 4200K and puts out over 3000 lumens. It is miniature and lightweight, only about the size of a 6V floating lantern, but should be much brighter with more throw than either of the HID's you were comparing. I ordered one and the scheduled delivery is this Monday so I will let you know how I like it as soon as I get it.

Chongker said:

...and I'm a little disappointed?

It's me first ever HID, which I bought from a fellow member on the MP (great deal for it too ). Arrived in the mail recently, and after charging it up a little, I fired it up and though WOW that's bright . Brought out my M6 and was surprised to see that there really wasn't that much difference in terms of output between the lights, despite the M6 being rated 500 lumens and the Boxer 1800. I also happen to have a Solarforce L1200 rated at 1200 lumens (though more like 900 lm.) and they was roughly equal in terms of output.

Took the L1200 and the Boxer out for a walk in the countryside tonight, and learnt why people usually prefer the 4300K HIDs as opposed to the 6000K bulb in the Boxer. The boxer had ever so slightly more throw, but the incan beam was just so nice for walking out in the woods, especially against the slightly ghostly blue tint of the Boxer.

For now then, i'm still very much an incan guy, though i'm hoping someone here will try to convince me otherwise? Was really looking for this light to stomp everything else I had in terms of output, but it didn't. In fact I think the el cheapo Solarforce (~$100) had even higher output than the boxer. Do HID bulbs lose brightness over the course of their life? Since I bought the light second hand, that might be the case that i'm not seing it at full brightness, or could it just be that I was expecting too much?

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Not to say you did anything wrong but yes, I think you were expecting too much and probably underestimated the performance of your current lights.

A 24W HID light is a 24W HID light if the specs of the ballast are stated accurately. The Solarforce is rated at 30W and should be somewhat brighter but also I'd be very surprised if it was a true 30W. The Boxer is over rated at 1800 lumens as it's closer to 1300 lumens at 24W and 6000K. My guess is that the difference in throw that your seeing has more to do with a different reflector texture between the two lights, since the reflector size is similar.

With regards to the M6, it's lumen ratings are giving as an average over its entire runtime. The MN21 on fresh primaries can actually push close to 600 lumens for a few minutes before they sag.

When I owned my Boxer24 it still threw noticeably farther than the MN21, but its true capability is limited by its OP or frosted reflector, which ever type yours happens to have. One main difference is that while the MN21 output falls quickly, the Boxer retains relatively steady output due to regulation, although it's still way short of perfectly flat regulation.

New HID bulbs to have a break in time before best performance is reached. After that they steadily decline in output over their lifespan, although not greatly.

I still think it's a great light due to it's form factor and common battery. Balancing your 18650 cells from time to time will help this light to perform at its best. If you're using the sellers batteries, I would test them all and see what each cell is charging to and what it's ending at. This could reveal a cell that's not performing up to par. It makes a difference with the Boxer because it doesn't maintain flat regulation and dims the longer that it's on. It does appear to have some type of regulation according the run charts that I've seen.

Yes the Boxer takes a very good set of 18650's to work well. AW's are possibly the best for this light. I actually tried some A123 (18650 with different chemistry for high current draw applications) cells in mine and it seemed to work fine although I'm sure the runtime will be shorter.

Thanks for the replies guys .

Maybe that was it, thinking too highly of the light before I even got it. Was just a little surprised though, that the Solarforce incan was brighter than the Boxer HID. Just confirmed that with my lightmeter on a ceiling bounce test. Even though the Solarforce is at a higher wattage than the Boxer, I still would have expected the Boxer to have a higher light output since HIDs should be more efficient in converting electricity to light, and didn't expect WE to inflate their lumen ratings that much. 1300 real lumens as opposed to 1800 stated?

I used freshly charged AW 18650s to run the light while the original batteries were out having an individual charge, no diff in output. Looks like I'll have to look into bluebeam's suggestion on the AmondoTech if I want a brighter light, though I may wait and spring for the L35 instead? :devil: I'm lumen hungry!

I highly recommend the N30, as it would be much brighter than the Boxer 24W. I'm sure the L35 would be great too.
I will do a comparison between the Sam's Power On Board HID and the AmondoTech N30 tomorrow night, and let you know how they do.:thumbsup:

Chongker said:

Thanks for the replies guys .

Maybe that was it, thinking too highly of the light before I even got it. Was just a little surprised though, that the Solarforce incan was brighter than the Boxer HID. Just confirmed that with my lightmeter on a ceiling bounce test. Even though the Solarforce is at a higher wattage than the Boxer, I still would have expected the Boxer to have a higher light output since HIDs should be more efficient in converting electricity to light, and didn't expect WE to inflate their lumen ratings that much. 1300 real lumens as opposed to 1800 stated?

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Well, I messed up a little and remembered the Solarforce as a different light altogether and it's not the light I was thinking of. Now I know what the Solarforce is because I went and looked it up. Anyhow, I'm also surprised that the Boxer24W isn't brighter than that light. I'm not sure how much of a difference was registered by your meter, but a lot of that might have to do with the color temperature of the light. The 6000K+ might not register as high of a reading.

I just received my N30 and it blew me away! It is noticeably brighter than my Power On Board HID with a much larger round hotspot and much nicer color beam. I highly recommend it now!:thumbsup:

I will edit this post tonight after I test it against the Power On Board with the results.

UPDATE:

I just did my comparison and the POB had more throw and a brighter hotspot than the N30, and the N30 was quite a bit brighter and put out more light. The N30 also gave much better color rendition.
The POB's beam was narrow and laser like compared to the N30 and put a very bright spot on trees 300 yards away, but the N30 had a much wider beam with more overall light output and it still lit up the trees at 300 yards away very brightly.
Overall the N30 really beat the POB.

BlueBeam22 said:

I just received my N30 and it blew me away! It is noticeably brighter than my Power On Board HID with a much larger round hotspot and much nicer color beam. I highly recommend it now!:thumbsup:

I will edit this post tonight after I test it against the Power On Board with the results.

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Saw your thread and glad you like it :thumbsup: Looks like I know what my next buy will be. But am probable gonna wait awhile for the L35 to come out like everyone else, and if it's much better i'll get that. If it isn't loads better i'm hoping the N30's will go for cheaper, so it looks like a win or win with waiting.

Patriot36 said:

Well, I messed up a little and remembered the Solarforce as a different light altogether and it's not the light I was thinking of. Now I know what the Solarforce is because I went and looked it up. Anyhow, I'm also surprised that the Boxer24W isn't brighter than that light. I'm not sure how much of a difference was registered by your meter, but a lot of that might have to do with the color temperature of the light. The 6000K+ might not register as high of a reading.

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Just double checked the meter reading again. On a ceiling bounce, both lights managed to tip 80 lux on my meter, with the Solarforce being just a touch higher. The WE seems to throw slightly better, but overall light output still seems very similar to th much lower specced Solarforce. I'll contact the seller and ask just how old the light is and maybe i'll get an idea. Anyways, quite liking the form factor of the Boxer, especially the longer runtime (compared to incan.) and adjustable focus . It's just the 6000K bulb and less than expected output that's bothering me. Ohh well, still a good light IMO and it's been out three nights since it arrived, proving useful.