I want "NUKE" Mode

kengps

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As mentioned on another thread by Chevy-SS......I want a max output "Nuke" mode that is good for about 5-10 seconds. After that it will drop to it's normal sustainable output. I'm not talking about a hard time limit, just give me whatever it will survive for that time frame. A temp sensor would work best, but that's probably too much trouble to incorporate. The manufacturer of the light could determine what output the light can handle for that time and program it into the driver, along with a cool-down time before it can be used again. Should not be that difficult to accomplish.
 

kengps

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It sounds like "exploding battery" mode.

Why? Batteries are capable of delivering more current than LED's can handle. The limitation is going to be the heat the LED can handle. LED's can handle a lot more heat for 10 seconds then they can for sustained operation, which is what the manufacturers use to determine max output.
For example....you could easily build a pocket light that would make 1200 lumens for 5 seconds with an SST-50, but would only be good for 500 or so for sustained operation. I want the 1200 lumens for flashing tactical operations. (and showing off to my friends)
 
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Swedpat

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It was a thread a while ago (I think it was at general flashlight discussion) about the same matter, but don't remember the name of it.
 

AnAppleSnail

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This isn't a light that would have enough demand to be manufactured. To supply power for a nuke mode would require that you always use special batteries (even supercapacitors are impractical), it'd require a microcontroller and high-quality programming, and wouldn't really be that much brighter. How bright is an XP-G at 2 amps instead of 1.5? At 3 amps you won't even get twice as many lumens as at spec, and it will only look about 1/3 brighter than running it at spec.

You'll need a custom light using IMR-something batteries, an MCU with temperature sensor, custom machined (one-piece maybe) body, and the "turbo" would be running an SST-90 at nearly spec - it'd be underclocked 99% of the time.
 

kengps

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I totally dissagree Apple. As I said a temp sensor would be best...but not at all neccessary. The manufacturer simply has to do the testing and program the time limit as neccessary. It would be no more than an additional mode added. Such as 6 Amps (or Direct-drive), 2.8 amp, 1.0 Amp, etc. No different than what is already out there. Many boards now that cost under $9.00 have 20 modes, and you select which combo you want by soldering a bridge. It isn't asking much. And no super-capaciters needed. An IMR or even a Li-ion 18650 will pull over 5-6 amps no problem for short time periods. Multi-mode boards already have a clock built in for the strobe and SOS function. All I'm asking for is a Direct-drive or 5-6 amp mode with a limiter.
 

Dude Dudeson

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But what about the 0.000001 lumen mode?

What about the tint? You have to love a pure white tint and hate any yellow, or love yellow tint and hate that "Blue" or "Green" invasion of your privacy...

What about runtime junkies, how will you ever plot a runtime curve with such a setup without knowing in advance how many times this "nuke mode" gets used?

Sorry man, you are requesting a custom light, and this will always be a custom request, and it will be unlikely that any major player will produce it.
 

gcbryan

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I see two issues with this approach. First, only the SST-50 or SST-90 are likely to be used in lights at the lower end of their spec where it would even be possible to increase the current that much.

Secondly, the result is not likely to garner the "wow" reactions from others that you are expecting.

Most lights result in this big an increase in current when you go from medium to high. When you have a XR-E R2 in a flashlight and go from medium to high do people go "wow"? It's going from roughly 100 lumens to 200 lumens. It's not going to be much different if you go from 500 lumens to 1000 lumens.
 
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TorchBoy

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How bout an extra $10 bucks? Thats twice what a good 17 mode driver board goes for.
So you want no more than 10 minutes of custom programming, and fabrication of the light for free? Sounds like you need to take it up as a hobby. :twothumbs
 

Dude Dudeson

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Most lights result in this big an increase in current when you go from medium to high. When you have a XR-E R2 in a flashlight and go from medium to high do people go "wow"? It's going from roughly 100 lumens to 200 lumens. It's not going to be much different if you go from 500 lumens to 1000 lumens.

I got a real good lesson on the "reverse exponentiality" of lumens on the SJ night hike.

I had a 6P with an M60. There were a ton of far more powerful lights present that night.

I was BLOWN AWAY at how well my humble light held up against the competition. Don't get me wrong, I saw an Olight SR90 light up the other side of a lake 3000 feet away (according to Google Earth measurement), and my light couldn't even do a thing there.

But within, say, 200 feet - the Big Dogs weren't really doing all that much more! Really it just came down to bigger illumination area, I'd just have to sweep my beam around a bit more.

HUGE POINT here, we're talking about lighting up areas of hillside the size of football fields, and hundreds of feet away.

The M60 barely pulls that off, but it does.

The 2200 lumen Olight SR90 obviously does it better, and can throw further. The DEFT was there that night - that thing is a spotlight, period. Sub 300 lumen, but wow. But it's a spotlight.

Your Nuke Mode, well what do you want that for? Blinding an opponent?

I propose the money would be better spent on pepper spray.

I'd say MAYBE this "Nuke Mode" might be handy for certain LEO and military, but that's a big maybe. If there really was such a market it would be filled...
 

gcbryan

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So you want no more than 10 minutes of custom programming, and fabrication of the light for free? Sounds like you need to take it up as a hobby. :twothumbs

Cost is not the issue. It's not much harder to do what he is asking than it is to build any other light. If enough people wanted it to justify making it cost would not be the issue.

There just wouldn't be many who would want it because it wouldn't have the "wow" factor that some are anticipating. So, basically, there is no point or reason for producing one in the first place.
 

StarHalo

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My EDC, the long-discontinued Jetbeam Jet-I Mk IBS, has a max output that will easily fry both the LED and battery in a few minutes if left unchecked; it's a lot like a good sports car that allows you to turn the traction control off, letting the experienced user get the most out of the machine.

The catch is that you have to keep it away from inexperienced users when powered by a Li-Ion..
 

Roger999

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o hai I found the exact same thread with 70posts....

https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/272752

EDIT: I can't think of any "tactical situation" where you would need 1200lumens for only 5seconds...... Most LEOs and people in the military are fine with <200lumens output for pistol/rifle mounted weapons or handheld flashlights.......
 
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PMM

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you have not seen an exploding led then from the sounds of it..

Yes they can turn into balls of pure white phosphorous type bullets rocketing across the room as the LED ignites the plastic via intense heat.

man did I get a shock that day.... my fault introduced it to the full current of a beefy PSU by accident.

Still it was an amazing sight to see.
 

Noctis

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As mentioned on another thread by Chevy-SS......I want a max output "Nuke" mode that is good for about 5-10 seconds. After that it will drop to it's normal sustainable output. I'm not talking about a hard time limit, just give me whatever it will survive for that time frame. A temp sensor would work best, but that's probably too much trouble to incorporate. The manufacturer of the light could determine what output the light can handle for that time and program it into the driver, along with a cool-down time before it can be used again. Should not be that difficult to accomplish.
A manufacturer could do this, but they wouldn't. They wouldn't make a separate mode to "impress" friends, because that has no practical application.

And while some have sold lights as a "defensive" tool, using the blinding effect as a selling point, there are a few bumps as to the actual "tactical" part of it. Firstly, you would more than likely want it to be the first mode accessible, as your attacker will likely laugh at you if you try to switch over to the "nuke" mode while he's punching your face into your skull. But then again, if you also want to USE the light in a practical sense, it would be unnecessarily annoying to switch out of nuke mode to a lower level every time you use it, draining power and potentially blinding someone unintentionally(could be avoided with precautions, but that just makes it all the more unnecessarily tedious).

This is just my own assumptions, but if we're discussing "nuke" mode for the purposes of self-defense, I would assume that you would want:
A) A small and pocketable size so that you have it with you wherever you go.
B) Enough output to overwhelm those even in ambient lighting.(makes it more useful in different times of the day and under street lighting).

I'll simply refer to my own testing with my Surefire 6P running an SST-90 drop-in in Direct Drive.

Now requirement A would severely limit the available heatsinking of the light. When I drove my light at 7-8 amps, the emitter started turning blue within 3-5 seconds. That severely limits the practical runtime of the light.

Requirement A also cuts off any regulation. As I understand it, 2.8A is more or less the limit of current regulation for lights of this size. The light will have to be direct drive, and I believe direct drive with multiple modes will also have limitations on the maximum current you can put through the driver.

Requirement B would be, in my opinion, more than the currently available 650 OTF lumens from Nailbender's SST-90 drop-in. I assume this because you want a "nuke" mode despite its availability in such a small size format. I'm guessing about 1,000 OTF lumens sounds about right, which is personally what I would want as well. To get that output OTF, the light would have to be driven hard, meaning high current, possibly over 5A.

When running that high of an output, my McClicky switch became damaged. The spring would warp, and over time, the plastic components would melt. A stock switch won't even handle current over 3 amps. And it only takes 10 seconds for the spring to warp.

Resistance needs to be lowered(usually with a wire spring mod) to draw more than 5A from an IMR 18650 battery, or more than 4A from an AW 18650 2600mAh cell.

All-in-all, too much custom work for a manufacturer.


I would suggest saving up $500 and paying someone to make you a custom pocketlight with a Triple XP-G with a 4-4.5A current draw, high/low mode with no mode memory, running off a 18650 2600mAh cell, and a crenellated bezel. Or wait for VanIsleDSM to finish his Quad XP-G drop-in and just buy that.
 

kengps

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"all in all too much custom work for a manufacturer" ?? Nope. Could be done for a few cents more on a manufacturing run. I will probably have to build it myself I guess. Modoo triple is impossible to get, and besides, it will run at its top level for sustained periods. Not the point I'm trying to make. Yes, I have seen an LED go nuke. Burned up more than one, and boy was it beautiful for the 4-5 seconds while it lasted. Just give me a lower level enough to last a few seconds more.
 
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Noctis

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"all in all too much custom work for a manufacturer" ?? Nope. Could be done for a few cents more on a manufacturing run. I will probably have to build it myself I guess. Modoo triple is impossible to get, and besides, it will run at its top level for sustained periods. Not the point I'm trying to make. Yes, I have seen an LED go nuke. Burned up more than one, and boy was it beautiful for the 4-5 seconds while it lasted. Just give me a lower level enough to last a few seconds more.
"A few cents more" sounds like a gross exaggeration if you don't mind me saying.

Unless they can cram such high current regulation into a light that small, they'll need to play around with the resistance to make it draw that high current. And that resistance thing will have to be more professional looking than a wire soldered to the spring.

Sagging current is an ugly thing, and it will poop on the nuke in direct drive.

For most emitters, such an overdrive would mean certain death. Logically, that only leaves the SST-50/90 emitters.

I still think most switches will melt down from that current.

Besides which, it will get real hot real fast. Lumens will drop from the heat, which could make the lower mode even lower with the heat from the nuke mode.

Sounds easy on paper, but I really don't hear a lot about lights like this. None in fact. Closest thing I found was moviles' mod that drove an SST-90 to 9A in a pocket-size format, but not like what you're suggesting.
 
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