Anyone tried Phoenix reflectors?

[AlexGT]

I saw the new ad today for Phoenix Electroformed Reflectors on the top of the CPF page and I am wondering If anyone has used their products and how much they cost.

http://www.phoenixelectroforms.com/parabolic_standard_products.html

I can see a good market for such a company if they keep the prices reasonable and can supply small orders.

I would love to see the PA-10 4.75" Diam 4.69" deep reflector focusing a SST-90.

Are you all exited to see reflector manufacturers advertising on CPF? I am!

I wish I had a lathe and knew how to use it.

AlexGT

 

[Linger]

+1
I saw the banner and looked around their site and believe I went through all the sections. But that's as far as it went: i thought it looked great but didn't know what I might be interested in or how I would order it from them. Even if they'd sell small (individual?) part orders.

I'd love a post in the b/s/t/ from them explaining which products for what emitters, a little pic next to popular lights. I know some reflectors are crap, but sourcing a replacement has thus far eluded me.

 

[Parabolic]

Single piece sales are welcomed. Prices vary with coatings applied. Feel free to contact and discuss.

 

[luckybucket]

Awesome! Another manufacturer that post in the forums. I'm interested in your products but I have to wait for the all the other pieces and parts to come in for my project so for now I just want to say thanks for posting. It inspires confidence.

 

[Linger]

Feel free to contact and discuss.

I feel that I need more information before I could have a discussion on reflectors. I know little about shape, little about coatings. It would be a short conversation: "your product line confounds me: what do you recommend for X emmitter and Y by Z host?"

Electron Guru, for example, creates a comprehensive explanation of options and outcomes. As a result he's got people ordering coloured ceramic coatings on lights, an obviously rare treatment but its presented in a wholly convincing manner.

 

[Parabolic]

The majority of uses for our reflectors has been with compact short arc Xenon, HID, and more recently with the D2S automotive style lamps. The relatively small source size and large projection angle of this style lamp allows the most effective collection of energy, and produces a very collimated searchlight beam.
The hemispherical lens along with the limited viewing/projection angle of a given LED provides a large directional source that will not function the same as an arc. We have just recently been receiving inquiries by customers who need reflectors and either use or want to use LED's. For most applications, the standard product reflectors on our website are too large to efficiently work within the design parameters provided, so custom reflectors which are much smaller were designed for them.
I would like to put together a list of some of the more popular LED's to begin modeling reflectors around, but am honestly not that familiar with what's being used. Any suggestions would be appreciated.

 

[Linger]

Well said.

So as you don't re-invent the wheel, I did some digging.

Here's a thread on some fairly popular work that's come before you:
http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=91615

Beamshots of above mentioned reflectors:
http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=118177

pdf with build dimensions of above:
http://dmcleish.com/CPF/reflectors/

(If you have the capacity to evaulate the led domes, you could make the largest impact. Scattered reports suggest the led dome, a standard feature across manufacturors, is the bottleneck in led output. work out a hack for the domes that maximized the potential of your reflectors could offer clear no-contest supremecy over competition.)

You asked briefly about 'popular' led's.
Cree xpg package, r5 is highest flux bin and most efficient led on the market.

Luminus ssx - 90 seems to be more popular on CPF. Identical luminus emitters come in two formats, sst for bare emitter, ssr for emitter mounted on star. The luminus ss_-90 is rated up to 9amps, and many are attracted to that potential power. The luminus ss_ -50 seems less common as it is only rated to 5amps, however it is the same size as previous emitters so many lights may be modded to a ss_ - 50 by simply swapping the emitter.

Favourite thrower has been Cree xre in r2 flux. This small emitter boasts the highest surface luminous intensity (largest output / smallest die size) so it makes a great thrower.

The Rebel 100 is a great emitter, small and efficient, but it is rarely discussed.

Quad die emitters Cree mc-e, and Seoul Semi Conductor's P7 were the highest output options before Luminus was release past summer. These packages unite 4 dies under one dome, producing the higher output with obvious knock-on problems of dark patches from the space between emissive surfaces.

 

[Pekka]

Favourite thrower has been Cree xre in r2 flux. This small emitter boasts the highest surface luminous intensity (largest output / smallest die size) so it makes a great thrower.

Doesn't Cree's XP-E pack the lumens in a smaller area? I'd go after that for a throw in that case. :thinking:

 

[Parabolic]

Thank you for the great information Linger. I appreciate that you took the time and will begin researching.

 

[Linger]

Doesn't Cree's XP-E pack the lumens in a smaller area?

I don't have a good answer. it may? but it's not the best thrower. instead of the tight beam angle, the xpe's with-out a metal ring have a wider angle. Now instead of reflectors sitting on top of the metal ring, the xpe's wide dispersion meant they had to be sit up inside of the reflector, and the hot spot was never as tight.

 

[Pekka]

I don't have a good answer. it may? but it's not the best thrower. instead of the tight beam angle, the xpe's with-out a metal ring have a wider angle. Now instead of reflectors sitting on top of the metal ring, the xpe's wide dispersion meant they had to be sit up inside of the reflector, and the hot spot was never as tight.

I'll give you what I have experienced first hand, since I'm not exactly an reflector expert and therefore wouldn't want to delve too deeply into the academic discussion. In terms of throw I've noticed XP-E has had always as tight hotspot or tighter than XR-E, while both are significantly tighter than XP-G powered lights. Also, I've read about incans having pretty wide angle (well it's all around) but due to small emitting area, can be focused into a throwy light. Most notably, the metal collar in XR-E has only helped in creating the black "donut holes" in the beam.

 

[bshanahan14rulz]

Not to mention with the lambertian emission it throws more light to the side for the reflector to collect, so logically one would conclude that it at least contributes a little lux to the hotspot

@Phoenix correspondant, LEDs commonly used around here are lambertian LEDs like the Seoul Semi.'s P4 and Luxeon line (and cree XP series), and the Cree XR-E with a more forward focused pattern. There are also some oddballs that are very popular for their high output in a single package. These include the Cree MC-E and the Seoul Semiconductors' P7.

 

[Walterk]

@Parabolic: Glad to see you sell to end users.
Hope you will answer the mail I send last weekeind about shipping overseas.

 

[Aircraft800]

Single piece sales are welcomed. Prices vary with coatings applied. Feel free to contact and discuss.

Parabolic,

Great to see a new manufacture here, and one that's interested in our obsession. When I saw you banner ad, I immediately clicked it. Lots of info there for me to digest, but I'll wait to see some of your ideas and designs.

I've got a 52mm reflector in a Maglite with a 14W Solarc HID, maybe a specific HID reflector will give a tighter spot.

:welcome:

 

[KuKu427]

I've never actually ordered from them...
But I know they answer emails fast and are very helpful!

 

[Phaserburn]

Reflectors for Mag C/D size lights would be welcomed by a great many of us; they are needed with different coatings (orange peel, stipple, smooth) and with different size openings.

Do you carry this size? Pricing? There are zillions of modded Maglites in population on the forum here, and more added all the time. P7/MCE/SST50 leds need a little different treatment vs. hotwire incan bulbs, which do great with standard parabolic shape but coated to eliminate artifacts, rings and shadows.

:welcome:

 

[Parabolic]

Thanks for the welcome Phaserburn, and to everyone else as well.

We are excited with the response we have been getting from our ad here on CPF.

As I mentioned previously, our reflectors are pure parabolas. This geometry may or may not be a good match for the various LED's available and testing will need to be done to make that determination (either by us, individual modders, or both).

Our manufacturing process will make a very accurate reflector, which is the advantage we have over other means of fabrication such as stamping, spinning, injection molding, etc. Unfortunately, the electroforming process is not an inexpensive one, and competing with those other methods of fabrication is often not warrented for the increase in output vs. the added cost.

In the case of the Mag reflectors, I'm not sure if you are looking for a source other than Mag for the same reflector, or if you are looking for something different that will fit in the same housing.
Most of the time when a custom reflector is required, the designer comes to us with a curve that has been designed around the source that they intend to use. We then build a tool to replicate the desired curve from and make the reflectors. Conversely, the designer may choose one of our standard reflectors and design their product around it.

I'm not sure if this answers your questions or just raises more. In either case, I'd be happy to continue the conversation.

 

[Mettee]

I dont think the majority of flashlight, or mag modders here would be able to design their own reflector. We would more than likely have to rely on the professionals for that

If you guys could design one or two affordable, efficient reflectors for us, you would have to be comfortable in knowing they would sell very well. VERY WELL.

I personally just used the mag rebel led reflector in a P7 build and it worked well. Something close to that would be good.

 

[Phaserburn]

Actually, I was thinking of a Mag parabolic reflector of the same dimensions with two differences: 1. made of aluminum to handle heat from higher power light sources and 2. an orange peel or stipple surface to eliminate rings and artifacts in the beam.

 

[spencer]

KD does (or did) sell an aluminum OP reflector for $15. I have one.