CPF and Racism

[txwest]

Silviron,
I'm very much in aggreement with your post, but the last line somehow went zip,... right over my head.

TX

 

[Silviron]

Lousy joke if you have to explain it. Oh well, there goes my shot at writing for Jay Leno.

meter = meet her

P.S. I'm not really a KKK member. I despise THEM as much as I do any radical person or group that wants to destroy any other person or group merely because they exist or breathe the same air.

 

[Unicorn]

I'd like to state two things about this topic.
First, I don't accept the concept of race. It does not truly exist, except for the human race. The rest was an artifical construct of some Europeans. The biggest difference, skin color, is really nothing more than a dark, permanent sun tan. Are there any true biological, or physiological differences?

Second, the comments about persons from the Middle East got my attention. How can you tell a person from the Middle East? Not everyone wears a turban, and not everyo9ne who wears a turban is from the region we call the Middle East. Skin color maybe? Well, the country that is now called Iran (formerly Persia BTW) is mostly white/caucasian. There are aryan (by that I mean white, not some Nazi BS) tribes in Afganistan, and other countries.

I don't have any real points to make, I just had to toss in my 1 cent.

 

[txwest]

Silviron,
OOOHHHHH,.....Now that you explained it..... it makes no sense at all !!

TX

(don't give up your day job)

 

[**DONOTDELETE**]

Unicorn-of course there are biological and physical differences between races.How many white guys have you met with sickle cell anemia?Have you ever compared casts of teeth from different races.The differences are amazing.Hair types too.(and these are just a couple examples off the top of my head)To say the only difference is skin tone is not correct.People are different.There is nothing racist about recognizing it.I think it makes the world a more interesting place.
troy

 

[lightlover]

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by darell:
... I have no tolerance for intolerance ...<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Me neither !!

(There is a rationalisation for that apparent contradiction in terms, but I can't remember it right now ... )

We have plenty of space and time to work out a definition of what's acceptable. We can do it as situations arise, once we've worked out a general basis for a Policy.
(Which we are doing - right here, right now.)

I can predict with certainty that nothing will please everyone, not in a group of this size.

Although let's keep in mind that CPF is a public place while your thoughts are yours alone: until you choose to express them.

I think that if a CPF member in good standing asks for a specific term to be avoided, then we should probably respect their wishes.
What has anyone got to lose by that courtesy ? You can hardly claim "there's a privilege gone !"

If you thereby lose out on the opportunity to make a joke of some kind, then make another joke instead.

Oh my, I could post such a lot more if I wasn't so tired at the moment.

lightlover

Moderator Darell, d'you reckon some of these dudes need a whuppin' ??

 

[**DONOTDELETE**]

Alright-I'll step up first and say that I am offended by the term "corn country" as it is used to describe the midwest.There is alot more here than just corn.People will often say, "you are right in the middle of CORN COUNTRY"
I usually correct them gently by saying, "actually,I prefer to call it the Heartland."(although,I now realize that that might offend artificial heart recipients)Oh well,you can't please everybody.

Just lay off the Corn Country references.It really hurts my feelings.Seriously.

troy

 

[Silviron]

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>[QB]....I think that if a CPF member in good standing asks for a specific term to be avoided, then we should probably respect their wishes...
[QB]<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Please don't do this.

You will be opening a "can of worms". If you want to issue a general statement along the lines of "Please be considerate of people's feelings and try not to use racial slurs, etc." I could support that.

But if you start censoring words that someone, somewhere MIGHT find offensive you will "cut the heart out of CPF". I don't think David will be happy when he gets back from his trip to find that you have started to dictate what people may say on HIS creation.

Let the forum "police" itself in that respect. Most of us are kind, generous and considerate; few, if any, would intentionally hurt another member's (or even a stranger's) feelings.

If someone is offended by something, let THEM say so to the person who wrote the offending statement. And if the offender does not respond in a mature manner, I think that the general opinion of the members as a whole will tend to make things right.

Personally, I think that a very few of our members are silly, immature and ignorant of many things. But they are also very creative, incredibly enthusiastic and technically savvy. Should we ban them just because an old curmudgeon like me finds their occasional childishness offensive?

When I hesitated to volunteer as a moderator, it was because I was worried that I would be tempted to censor or edit posts that I thought juvenile or just plain silly. I think I can handle the temptation to force my opinions upon others..... Can you?

The way I understand it, David wants us to see that the forums run smoothly and to help the "new guys" get their links and things like that to work properly, NOT to become the moral guardians of the universe.

 

[**DONOTDELETE**]

I hope people realized that I was being sarcastic.I always say I'm from corn country,I just wanted to be the first to have a phrase on the censor's list.

We use alot of Ethanol in our gasoline(made from corn)in Illinois.
Does this make my car a Corn Rocket?
just wonderin'
troy

 

[Silviron]

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>
Does this make my car a Corn Rocket?
just wonderin'
troy<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Hey, That's right. Fermented rice makes a very powerful alcohol, and the Japanese DID use it for a fuel during WWII. (much to the detriment of the civilian people's food intake).

I'll bet that is the REAL source of the term that has become so offensive.

The area between where you live and I live is called "FLY-OVER-COUNTRY" by the "Sophisticates" of the world. We ought to ban THAT term which is disparaging of us.

 

[**DONOTDELETE**]

I didn't know that about the rice.I bet that is the origin of that term.Is anyone offended by the term Flashaholic?Maybe that one should go to.I had an uncle who was Alcoholic.That hits pretty close to home for me.Better just put it on the list to be safe.
(...don't mind me,I was just being facetious again.)
troy
Did you say I lived in FLY-OVER COUNTRY Silviron?Thems fightin' words.
Ban the phrase!!

 

[DonL]

A few thoughts.

There are some excellent points being made here, especially for such a diverse group.

Regarding "political correctness", I feel that at times it's closer to censorship by prohibiting people to freely speak their minds. On the other hand, in a civilized society, communication and the expression of thoughts and ideas would be made frankly, sincerely, and with consideration towards others. There's a fine line that is ever-varying between open, courteous discourse and what others consider to be divisive, stereotyping, slander, and racist. I think I would rather see erring slightly more on the side of open discourse, if only for clarification of thoughts and ideas. If an idea or thought is based on incorrect assumptions, misinformation, or is simply wrong, then a courteous correction can be made.

Another forum I frequent, with ~20,000 members, erupted upon discussing profiling relative to 9/11. The remark that started it dealt with the idea that if there is a suspect or suspects for a crime that has a specific description, then people of that description should be looked at and scrutinized more closely.

Some considered it profiling because certain characteristics are often racial or regional in nature, which singles out everyone within that segment unfairly.

Others thought it only prudent to be more wary of people sharing certain characteristics or descriptive traits or features if a person or people possessing those traits is suspected of a crime.

One man's effective police work is another man's profiling.

This is another very fine line that's being tread on. Alot depends on the situation or circumstances surrounding a particular event. However, alot of common sense (which isn't very common anymore) is needed in order to recognize the appropriate circumstances and act accordingly without becoming too invasive.

 

[**DONOTDELETE**]

Ya'know what.Now that I really think about it,I realize that the whole approach to this "banning offensive phrases" idea is wrong.I mean- where is the fun in that?
We're a smart group(as a whole).Why not replace the offensive phrases with a kinder,gentler phrase that would get the point across.We could take a vote on each one and everything.Sounds pretty sweet.Doesn't it?
Oh yeah ,Darell,do you find it offensive that you are often referred to as a "goat thing"?I mean ,really,I would be offended if I were you.In fact,when I think about how much that must offend you,I get really offended.

Edited: Darell -I meant to say "cow-thing".What was I thinking.That picture of you was obviously a cow.But aren't you even more offended by "cow-thing" or "cow god-thing"?I mean,really,that is even worse than "goat-thing".

 

[Greta]

As the token "chick" on the board, I suppose I should weigh in on this subject...

I've been wandering around CPF for a little bit now, reading the posts and getting a feel for the overall tone of the board... and trust me!... you all have NOTHING to be concerned about as far as racism or any kind of UN-PC'ness or OVER-PC'ness... It is obvious that every one here is here because they have something in common... flashlights!... Everyone shows respect for others... no matter what the topic... You all REALLY have no idea how unique and incredible this board is!...

... If you'd like to get an idea... try going to some of these politcal bulletin boards...

You want to see tolerance at it's best? ... go to a liberal board... you'll want to throw up at all of the tolerance and PC'ness... and then go brsh your teeth from all the "sweetness"... ACK!!!

You want to see IN-tolerance at it's best? ... go to a conservative board... you'll want to slap a few people around for their close-minded bigotry and hypocrisy...

Disclaimer: Not all liberals and conservatives are as described above... however when it comes to politics, extremists from all sides inevitably are drawn into the fray and start slinging the mud.

The point is... you all have nothing to worry about here... A general statement such as:

You agree, through your use of CandlePowerForums, that you will not use this BB to post any material which is knowingly false and/or defamatory, inaccurate, abusive, vulgar, hateful, harassing, obscene, profane, sexually oriented, threatening, invasive of a person's privacy, or otherwise violate of any law.

and/or:

No threats, personal attacks, Promotion of illegal activities (including illegal drug use), hate speech, or attacks based on religious principles and/or religious beliefs will be tolerated.

Pretty general... intelligent people know what all that means... and probably wouldn't even consider any of that anyway... but it's an over all CYA type thing... in case (rare case on CPF) some idiot decides to show their idiocy... then you (moderator) would simply remind them (in private) of the policies and ask that they 'revise' their statements... if they don't... BOOT 'EM!... that simple...

None of this is up to interpretation... Everyone here is intelligent enough to know what is offensive and what is not... trying to define it with specifics is a dog trying to catch his tail... futile... and being of thin skin just isn't practical in this world...

Just my humble opinion... for what it's worth... but then I'm only a chick... so what do I know?....

 

[**DONOTDELETE**]

just a quick comment on the "rice rocket" issue. IMVeryHO, anyone who was offended by that needs to loosen up just a bit. Chances are those who were offended aren't asian. Anyone who has an ethnic background that is frequently the target of racism can tell very quickly if a comment or phrase like that is meant to be an attack. Clearly this was not in the least. The U.S. is becoming a little too PC lately. I know it makes you feel right and good to point out these "wrongs" but no wrong was committed.

 

[Darell]

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Troy Webber:
Darell, do you find it offensive that you are often referred to as a "goat thing"?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Goat? Who the hell is calling me a goat? I'm gonna start taking names and kicking some butt here! Now "cow thing," or "cow-god thing" - that's more like it!

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Sasha wrote
trying to define it with specifics is a dog trying to catch his tail<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
I got your point and all, but MY dog actually CAN catch his tail. He's somewhat "special" though, so I can understand your confusion. That just needed clearing up...

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by *something ridiculous ?:

Moderator Darell, d'you reckon some of these dudes need a whuppin' ??<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Well, yeah. Now more than ever. I never have met a guy (or gal!) who couldn't benefit from a good Darell whuppin.' Hey, look at that: I've got an extra can of whupass right here!

Ok, I think that catches me up. Seems that I come down squarely in, uh, the middle here. I don't want to see censorship, certainly. And while we are growing fast here at CPF central, we are doing a fantastic job of self policing. I'd hate to see somebody severely offended as much as I'd hate to see censorship. AAAggh. There simply is no way to keep everybody happy. The good news is that as a group, we're fairly well educated, and we all seem to have nothing but good intentions. Seems to me that good thinking and good intentions is enough to steer a pretty good path through the murky forest of "tolerance."

Whoa! That was pretty deep for a Saturday afternoon.

 

[Greta]

darell... thank you...

... I'll use a different anology then... Please insert the following in my post above...

"...trying to define it with specifics is a cat trying to find a corner in a round room... "

 

[Lonewolf]

Why am I not surprised Darell has the one dog rhat can actually catch his tail. A dog as "special" as his owner.

 

[**DONOTDELETE**]

It was a cow!-I stand corrected Darell.See what happens when I post late into the night

 

[Quickbeam]

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Are there any true biological, or physiological differences? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Just a "quickie" here - yes there are biological and physiological differences between the various members of the human race, BUT we are all 99% similar - more similar than ANY OTHER SPECIES IN THE ANIMAL KINGDOM.

Humans really are the most closely related group of "animals" on the planet.

See what you learn when you watch PBS!