humans are stupid

ghostguy6

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I'm a little ashamed to admit how many times I read this over and tried to make sense of it. Surely I must be reading it wrong, right?o_O
Nope, a PHD in Chemical Engineering put a rubber stopper in the sink drain, turned on the faucet then left for lunch. She said she thought she would be back in time. I estimate it takes about 10 minutes to fill the sink, lunch breaks are 1 hour. Math is obviously hard for her.

How many college professors would or could do their jobs?
Its funny you mention this, one of the employees I currently work with was a semi retired University professor yet he cant understand why I have to take the machinery out of service for routine maintenance. When he refuses to let me do the maintenance he wonders why the equipment is always breaking. He doesn't understand how important grease is in moving parts or that $2 in grease now saves $1000's on parts and downtime.
 

pnwoutdoors

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Its funny you mention this, one of the employees I currently work with was a semi retired University professor yet he cant understand why I have to take the machinery out of service for routine maintenance. When he refuses to let me do the maintenance he wonders why the equipment is always breaking. He doesn't understand how important grease is in moving parts or that $2 in grease now saves $1000's on parts and downtime.

Heck, as an eight year old, I appreciated how tear-down of the bike hubs and re-greasing everything kept the wheels turning. Never did want an "endo" that I'd deliberately caused. Had plenty of them unannounced, anyway, at that age.

I still treat the cars (hinges and other things) that way, to this day, untold decades later. "A penny of prevention is worth a pound of cure," or some such. Thanks Grandpa.
 

IMA SOL MAN

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Nope, a PHD in Chemical Engineering put a rubber stopper in the sink drain, turned on the faucet then left for lunch. She said she thought she would be back in time. I estimate it takes about 10 minutes to fill the sink, lunch breaks are 1 hour. Math is obviously hard for her.


Its funny you mention this, one of the employees I currently work with was a semi retired University professor yet he cant understand why I have to take the machinery out of service for routine maintenance. When he refuses to let me do the maintenance he wonders why the equipment is always breaking. He doesn't understand how important grease is in moving parts or that $2 in grease now saves $1000's on parts and downtime.
Peter Principle in action.

For such type were maintenance-free batteries made. Oh well, types like that are the type that auto mechanics and other repair trades people lust for--they are the big ticket jobs. Pay me now or pay me later. An LOF is cheap compared to an engine R&R.
 

knucklegary

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Yes... it pays to master equipment before you are out in the field 😋
I heard some of these submersible are hand made of carbon fiber. Hand laid-up like fiberglass. I would think the tiniest bubbles are a NoNo because of the extreme psi at those depths.. I heard these subs hulls go through No testing, No certification.. A recipe for disaster.
 

idleprocess

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I heard some of these submersible are hand made of carbon fiber. Hand laid-up like fiberglass.
The archival video/images I saw looked like a carbon fiber. It was not being hand laid up - the composite was being wrapped by a machine over a form - or perhaps an inner sleeve. Thus I'd expect the fabrication to be nearly ideal for the technology. However there are problems...

I heard these subs hulls go through No testing, No certification.. A recipe for disaster.
Subject of a lawsuit by a former employee.

The carbon fiber hull was not considered appropriate for the role:
Given the prevalent flaws in the previously tested 1/3 scale model, and the visible flaws in the carbon end samples for the Titan, Lochridge again stressed the potential danger to passengers of the Titan as the submersible reached extreme depths. The constant pressure cycling weakens existing flaws resulting in large tears of the carbon. Non-destructive testing was critical to detect such potentially existing flaws in order to ensure a solid and safe product for the safety of the passengers and crew.
[...]
Lochridge was particularly concerned about "non-destructive testing performed on the hull of the Titan" but he was "repeatedly told that no scan of the hull or Bond Line could be done to check for delaminations, porosity and voids of sufficient adhesion of the glue being used due to the thickness of the hull." He was also told there was no such equipment that could conduct a test like that.
They had no way to inspect the hull. In a vessel subject to something like 300 atmospheres of pressure. Using a composite laminate hull where layer delamination would introduce cascading structural deficiencies.

Their real time monitoring system might only provide milliseconds of warning:
Lochridge also expressed concern that the company planned for the sub to rely on an acoustic monitoring system to detect if the hull was breaking down or about to fail. That wouldn't provide much help in an emergency, Lochridge claimed in the filing, because the acoustic analysis would only alert people about imminent problems, "often milliseconds before an implosion."
This tragedy was almost inevitable. And were it not hull failure there were dozens of other things to go fatally wrong in this fly by the seat of the pants operation.
 

importculture

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For me it's how average has become more dumb. My grandads 4th grade education in 1920 was worlds better than my nephews 2009 high school diploma.

Grandad fought a war, raised a family & ran a home improvement/repair business. My nephew can't balance a checkbook, read or write cursive or spell w/o spell check. (truth is spelling isn't my best skill but I know how to use a dictionary)

Hell most/many collage graduates can barely make a good cup of Starbucks coffee .. LOL
Not to mention their generation memorized a lot of phone numbers. My grandparents knew all of our relatives and their friends phone numbers by heart. Plus any calculations were done in their head.
 

Galane

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One way to lay up 5" of carbon fiber without bubbles would be to place the form and machinery inside a room that can have the pressure reduced quite a bit. Should there be any bubbles trapped, when the cylinder is returned to normal pressure they'll be crushed, allowing full contact of the resin.

Carbon fiber tube like this are wrapped with a wide ribbon of continuous carbon fiber that is soaked in resin, usually an epoxy. The finished lay up is then heated to cure the resin. For best results the item should be put into a bag then vacuum pulled to make any trapped air come out and to firmly squeeze the layers together. For items where vacuum bagging isn't practical, like the inside of a deep hollow, pressure can be used. Insert a rigid plug that mostly fills the hollow, covered by a double layer silicone sleeve. Put a bit of air pressure into the sleeve and the outer layer presses against the fiber and resin layers to force them into contact with the inside of the mold, and to push air out.

For a 5" thick walled carbon fiber tube I'd expect that using a sonogram transducer on one side and a receiver on the other could spot flaws. The contact surfaces would need to be curved to fit snugly to the contour of the tube and a coupling gel that won't damage the tube would be needed to get best sound transmission.

The examination would be slow and painstaking. I'd want the rotation etc automated. There should be some automated method to spot flaws, and it would need several people to examine the visual sonogram recording.

The worst part would be any flaw would mean the very expensive tube would be scrap, or restricted to use on a submersible in shallow water.
 

Galane

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The #1 Oh Hell No for anyone contemplating taking a ride in the Titan submersible should have been not having a hatch capable of being opened from the inside. If there was a survivable emergency from which the thing was able to drop ballast and pop to the surface, the occupants could still die from lack of air before rescuers could arrive, hoist it aboard a ship and open it up.

What I'd like to see is someone with the big $$$ buy up all the bits and pieces left over from upgrades to DSV-2 Alvin, DSV-3 Turtle, and DSV-4 Sea Cliff. The original steel pressure spheres for the three were good for at least 6,500 feet. Quite a conservative rating when back in the 1960's it was the test chamber that ruptured nearing 10,000 feet equivalent pressure while the sphere intended to be tested to destruction was unharmed. 'Course that was before each of them had holes cut for 3 portholes, the access hatch, and various feedthroughs for wires and other things. The spheres with equipment inside could hold three people in cramped conditions. For a tourist sub there would need to be less stuff inside and the essentials could be far more compact than the equivalent systems from decades past. Mount all three steel spheres on a single frame and they could be the core of a boat able to go down 5,000 feet with an extreme safety margin. 6 to 8 tourists could be taken along, or that many scientists and researchers could go.

If one wanted to go deeper, get hold of Alvin's second sphere, made of titanium. Turtle still has its second sphere, a later one from Alvin, rated to 10,000 feet working depth. Sea Cliff got the titanium upgrade in 1984 (long after Alvin's in the 1970's.). The US Navy gave DSV-4 to Woods Hole in 1998. They refurbished it and returned it to service in 2002 but has since been cannibalized for parts for Alvin. However, since Alvin's last big rebuild that completed in 2014 removed the last remaining original components (making it a true Ship of Theseus) I'd assume Woods Hole could restore Sea Cliff back to how it was before it became a parts donor.

The current, all new, Alvin was fitted with a larger sphere, with 5 viewports VS the three it and the other two of its sister ships had, which was what necessitated the all new frame. I assume they took advantage of that to make changes and upgrades that had long been wanted but would have been more expensive, impractical, or impossible to do by modifying the 1960's original frame.

Getting hold of Turtle and any still existing parts removed for upgrades would be a tougher deal since its original sphere is in a museum and I assume the boat itself may still be claimed as US Navy property despite being stricken from the US Navy Registry in 1998 and it was on display at Mystic Aquarium in Connecticut. If the Navy officially donated, gave, sold, or otherwise transferred ownership of Turtle, then obtaining it to refurbish and upgrade would be considerably simpler than getting Woods Hole to turn loose of any old parts they still have from Alvin and Sea Cliff.

One of the neatest things I own is a DSV-4 Sea Cliff hat. I dunno if it's some gift shop thing or if it's a hat a crewmember used to own. I picked it up at a thrift shop in Boise, Idaho. If it was a crew hat, is it from its time under USN or Woods Hole ownership? I find it odd that the logo on it has a profile of the Trieste II, DSV-1, instead of a profile of the Alvin class boats.
 

idleprocess

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What I'd like to see is someone with the big $$$ buy up all the bits and pieces left over from upgrades to DSV-2 Alvin, DSV-3 Turtle, and DSV-4 Sea Cliff.
Ah, but someone has largely solved this problem vis-à-vis the DSV Limiting Factor rated to dive to 14,000 meters or deeper than any known depth in the world's oceans. Might cost more than $250,000 to charter it down to whatever location strikes your fancy, but it appears to be competently designed and properly certified by marine authorities.
 

bigburly912

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I manage the inventory for 2 electrical utilities. Same company, different areas. I am the sole source of ordering for these locations and I send and receive hundreds of calls/emails/correspondence daily. If I send an email with more than 50 words to any fresh out of school employee it is obvious that they haven't read that email. It is ridiculous and unprofessional but their fake daddy's money degree says they can do the job. The world is on fast track of collapse. I'm only 38 and I can see the writing on the wall.
 

Toulouse42

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I manage the inventory for 2 electrical utilities. Same company, different areas. I am the sole source of ordering for these locations and I send and receive hundreds of calls/emails/correspondence daily. If I send an email with more than 50 words to any fresh out of school employee it is obvious that they haven't read that email. It is ridiculous and unprofessional but their fake daddy's money degree says they can do the job. The world is on fast track of collapse. I'm only 38 and I can see the writing on the wall.
I was the compliance officer for my company. I once circulated a new procedures email which the staff were required to read. In that email i included the words "the first person to come to me will get a crisp new 20 pound note". The only person to claim the money was the most junior person (about 20 years old) and English wasn't even her first language.
 

Stress_Test

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I was the compliance officer for my company. I once circulated a new procedures email which the staff were required to read. In that email i included the words "the first person to come to me will get a crisp new 20 pound note". The only person to claim the money was the most junior person (about 20 years old) and English wasn't even her first language.

Heh, yeah the "failure to read" thing drives me bonkers sometimes at work too. I once emailed a guy detailed instructions on how to fill out a form. A week later the form comes back and everything is wrong. I felt like a professor who gives a kid the answer sheet to the final exam and the kid still fails!!
 
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