Lithium Batt. Explosion = Safety Meeting Topic at Work

[Stress_Test]

We have monthly safety meetings at work, and if there have been any significant "incidents" then those get discussed as part of the meeting.

Well today, one of the incidents was "exploding lithium battery", and I was surprised to see a slide photo of a Surefire G2! A mechanic had the light in his shirt pocket when the case burst due to the pressure of the leaking/frying cells. The guy just got a bruise (luckily) and his shirt pocket was torn from the force of the tailcap shooting off.

Anyway, it was stated that the light contained one Surefire battery and one Interstate battery. I'm guessing the different discharge characteristics of the two brands caused the one to go kaboom.

I just thought it was kind of a strange coincidence that this came up at a work safety meeting just as I'm getting interested in new flashlight tech!

 

[this_is_nascar]

Re: Lithium Batt. Explosion = Safefy Meeting Topic at Work

The problem is, you can't teach common sense. Whether you know anything about lights or anything about batteries or not, a little red-flag should appear when trying to mix them.

 

[Crenshaw]

please educate them, do a search here on CPF, and print out if you cann all the stories, or at least the important parts of the stories, the advice given by the members, and the pictures, the WILL get attention..

Crenshaw

 

[Stress_Test]

I'm beginning to think that maybe these high power lithium batteries are a bit unsafe for most of the general public. The majority of people out there probably don't know any better and think that 123 lithium is as ordinary as any AA, and don't realize the potential dangers.

Can't really blame people though. Unless you're an engineer or technician or something, you wouldn't really have any background knowledge on batteries and circuitry. And who reads warning labels anyway?!?!

 

[jufam44]

Good to see a workplace taking a proactive approach to Lithium Safety. Can I ask where you work?

 

[Chuck289]

There was an incident at my work a few years ago. It happened a little before I started working there. I guess they have recycling/disposal bins for batteries. One was for lithium batteries and apparently a small fire started when one of them vented. Now its required to tape up the terminals of the batterys and put them in some sort of tray before disposing of them.

 

[Patriot]

Re: Lithium Batt. Explosion = Safefy Meeting Topic at Work

The problem is, you can't teach common sense. Whether you know anything about lights or anything about batteries or not, a little red-flag should appear when trying to mix them.

Stress_Test
maybe these high power lithium batteries are a bit unsafe for most of the general public. The majority of people out there probably don't know any better and think that 123 lithium is as ordinary as any AA, and don't realize the potential dangers.

I completely agree Stress_Test. Although these things are second nature to me now, there was a time when I thought little of taking a couple of old surefire batteries and tossing them in a light. The fact is that you don't have to mix a brand X and a brand Y together to have a problem. Two batteries of a different charge level of the same brand can cause a problem.

Sometimes problems occur with batteries that were never mixed. They were installed new from the package. If the light has a draw of any kind the same problems can happen. This type of thing has even happened to some very experience CPFers who could have burned their house down or worse.

These batteries have been marketed to the general public without much education involved. Sure the worst of them catch fire but even top quality batteries can build up dangerous pressures since they all vent given the wrong circumstances. I've had to adjust the way that I handle and use lithiums but that doesn't mean the risk is gone. Hopefully in the future we'll have safer formulas.

 

[Crenshaw]

What freaks me out the most, is when a single cell batteryed light's battery vents...how does THAT happen? i recall it being a surefire cell...

basically it seems like...

you can run, but theres no where to hide...eventually,them lithiums are gonna getcha

Crenshaw

 

[Stress_Test]

Good to see a workplace taking a proactive approach to Lithium Safety. Can I ask where you work?

I'm a test engineer for Nasa. My group does static structural testing (crush, pull apart, bend, break, etc.)

 

[spoonrobot]

It was a Chinese "PW Powerstation" cell.

Link.

After getting a ZTS tester I haven't kept up in the battery forum, has there been other single cell vents/booms with 123A batteries?

 

[hopkins]

Question: what would happen if a new, out of package lithium AA primary
was subjected to a crushing blow from a hammer? or crimped in a vise?
Consequences?

 

[Supernam]

I'm a test engineer for Nasa. My group does static structural testing (crush, pull apart, bend, break, etc.)

NASA... COOL! What kind of flashlights do the astronauts use?

 

[Chuck289]

NASA... COOL! What kind of flashlights do the astronauts use?

The sun!

 

[Beamhead]

This link has massive info http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=124776

Bottom line, in any multi cell application use only good/same brand fresh/equal state cells.

I have seen toys with warnings not to mix cell brands or types so people really should know it but oh well. :shrug:

 

[Qoose]

Whew. I was expecting to walk in here and see a story of how a venting happened and all Surefires and CR123s would now be banned from the work place. Happens all to often now a days.

 

[matrixshaman]

Question: what would happen if a new, out of package lithium AA primary
was subjected to a crushing blow from a hammer? or crimped in a vise?
Consequences?

Not sure about the AA Lithiums but I punched a nail through a CR123 primary Lithium, put it in water before and after putting the nail through it and then recharged another Lithium primary (not a rechargeable) - and nothing happened in any of those cases. I've even put one across a 12 volt 10 amp car charger with no (used welders safety equipment). So I still maintain that they can be dangerous but that there is a bit of over reaction to the danger. I think some cells are defective right off the manufacturing line and those are going to be the ones that create a problem under normal use conditions. Others are put into situations where safety mechanisms kick in but once in a while the safety mechanism fails too - then you have a big problem as these will burn hot and create pressure in a sealed container.

 

[Burgess]

Yep, people really should know not to mix brands.


But when it comes right down to it . . . .



"Well, i only had one Brand A cell, and one Brand B cell,

and my flashlight takes TWO cells, so i just sorta' figured . . . . "



You can guess the rest.

_

 

[stitch_paradox]

What freaks me out the most, is when a single cell batteryed light's battery vents...how does THAT happen? i recall it being a surefire cell...

basically it seems like...

you can run, but theres no where to hide...eventually,them lithiums are gonna getcha

Crenshaw

What makes you think its a Surefire? Can you give a link to further prove your statement? Dont state any brands if you can't give a link. I might be wrong but I never heard anything like that happening to a battery made in the US, it's usually batteries that made abroad that faulty.

 

[Crenshaw]

stitch i am sorry but i honestly am sick of you biting my head of every single time i say something about surefire...ill give you the damn link when i find it....

EDIT:found your links..

http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=78843&page=2
NewBie's post...

http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=124776

scroll down

im still searching for the P2D explosion...

http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=169038&pp=10

okay it was a P1D, and it wasnt a surefire battery, Im SORRY stitch...

just take note that from newbie's posts...it it was most likley a surefire battery, and i dont know any other brand with that color anyway...and its always best to be careful. Its none of my business if you want to mix youre surefire batteries up just cos you think they can't explode.


Crenshaw

 

[ScubaSnyder]

At least it wasn't a double o-ring aluminum light !! Question for anyone to answer...Why don't they use the chemical absorbing crytals( not sure what they are) in all lights, they used to have them in a lot of scuba lights, I have a few Princeton tec lights that have them inside??? Are lithium bi-products different ?? I know they are in one light I have that run on NiMH batteries, please pm with the answer as I don't get on too much!