Suggestion for incan pocket rocket - **Got Seraph SP-6/IMR-9+D26-G4+WA1111**

hoongern

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Hi guys,

Up until now, I have been an LED person up until now, but I've always been curious on how incans perform, and I've never had a proper one (other than those cheapo 2aa/3D ones). So, I've been looking for a decent incan.

Since I always carry LED flashlights with me (Liteflux LF2XT, Fenix E01, PD30 and Quark AA w/ 14500), I don't care too much about runtime. I was thinking of the following:

Solarforce L2 + Lumens Factory IMR-9 (500lumens) + 2x AW 16340 IMRs

How would that work? The Solarforce would be a clicky, I've read that twisties are needed for high currents - is the L2 ok on this? Also, does the IMR-9 come with a reflector? (I think it does?)

I'm assuming that this would blow away my current brightest PD30?

However, I'm also thinking of getting a lower output module for use with the IMRs or regular AW Li-Co 16340s - what would be good? Around 80 lumens. I was looking at Lumens Factory ES-6 but it's rated at 6V while the 16340s would put out 8.4V - would this blow the bulb - and can it be used with a single 18650 @ 4.2V?

I may also look for a decent P60 LED dropin later on, but I'm just interested in the incan for now.

Also, I've seen the Solarforce L2 for $6 online - are these fakes?

Thanks!
 
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Re: Suggestion for incan pocket rocket - Perhaps SolarforceL2+LumensFactory IMR-9?

Hi guys,

Up until now, I have been an LED person up until now, but I've always been curious on how incans perform, and I've never had a proper one (other than those cheapo 2aa/3D ones). So, I've been looking for a decent incan.

Since I always carry LED flashlights with me (Liteflux LF2XT, Fenix E01, PD30 and Quark AA w/ 14500), I don't care too much about runtime. I was thinking of the following:

Solarforce L2 + Lumens Factory IMR-9 (500lumens) + 2x AW 16340 IMRs

How would that work? The Solarforce would be a clicky, I've read that twisties are needed for high currents - is the L2 ok on this? Also, does the IMR-9 come with a reflector? (I think it does?)

I'm assuming that this would blow away my current brightest PD30?

However, I'm also thinking of getting a lower output module for use with the IMRs or regular AW Li-Co 16340s - what would be good? Around 80 lumens. I was looking at Lumens Factory ES-6 but it's rated at 6V while the 16340s would put out 8.4V - would this blow the bulb - and can it be used with a single 18650 @ 4.2V?

I may also look for a decent P60 LED dropin later on, but I'm just interested in the incan for now.

Also, I've seen the Solarforce L2 for $6 online - are these fakes?

Thanks!
A real "pocket" rocket should be smaller than that... I consider the SureFire E2E + IMR-E2 + 2x16340 IMR to be the ultimate incandescent pocket rocket. The L2 is a huge light next to an E2E...

If you want to stick with the P60 form factor and get the most brightness out of it, then you have the SureFire P91 which is alot brighter than the IMR-9. Yes, all P60 compatible lamp asemblies come with the xenon lamp mounted in a reflector, that's why they are called lamp assemblies and not just bulbs.


However, I'm also thinking of getting a lower output module for use with the IMRs or regular AW Li-Co 16340s - what would be good? Around 80 lumens. I was looking at Lumens Factory ES-6 but it's rated at 6V while the 16340s would put out 8.4V - would this blow the bulb - and can it be used with a single 18650 @ 4.2V?
That's easy, just use the LF ES-9 with your regular liCo or IMR cells. Don't bother with a single li-ion, it will be horribly yellow and dim.
 
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Dioni

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Re: Suggestion for incan pocket rocket - Perhaps SolarforceL2+LumensFactory IMR-9?

There is also the FM d26 bi-pin adapter for a amazing output. However, talking about LA, nothing better the P91.

I agree that E-series body has better features to a pocket rocket. So, how about a McGizmo adapter to C head to E body? :naughty:
https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/250039

Cheers,
Dioni
 

hoongern

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Re: Suggestion for incan pocket rocket - Perhaps SolarforceL2+LumensFactory IMR-9?

A real "pocket" rocket should be smaller than that... I consider the SureFire E2E + IMR-E2 + 2x16340 IMR to be the ultimate incandescent pocket rocket. The L2 is a huge light next to an E2E...

I'm fine with the L2's form factor. Unfortunately, Surefire is out of my budget - I'm hoping not to go about $50-60 minus batteries.

If you want to stick with the P60 form factor and get the most brightness out of it, then you have the SureFire P91 which is alot brighter than the IMR-9. Yes, all P60 compatible lamp asemblies come with the xenon lamp mounted in a reflector, that's why they are called lamp assemblies and not just bulbs.

Is the P91 significantly brighter than the IMR-9? How do their beam patterns compare? From what I hear, the IMR-9 is pretty floody. Also - is the P91 overdriven on 2xIMRs?

There is also the FM d26 bi-pin adapter for a amazing output. However, talking about LA, nothing better the P91.

I agree that E-series body has better features to a pocket rocket. So, how about a McGizmo adapter to C head to E body? :naughty:
https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/250039

Actually, I was seriously considering the FM d26 bi-pin adapter - but from the looks of the sales thread, it's no longer available. If it is, I'd love to have it with the WA1111. Is the adapter available anywhere?

Whole light? FAKE.

Thought so =)
 

FlashKat

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Re: Suggestion for incan pocket rocket - Perhaps SolarforceL2+LumensFactory IMR-9?

Are you looking for a bright throw light or bright flood light?
 

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Re: Suggestion for incan pocket rocket - Perhaps SolarforceL2+LumensFactory IMR-9?

Are you looking for a bright throw light or bright flood light?
Huge throw with a 26mm reflector is virtually impossible. All these extreme-high output P60 lamp assemblies are all pretty darn floody with limited throw.
 

Dioni

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Re: Suggestion for incan pocket rocket - Perhaps SolarforceL2+LumensFactory IMR-9?

Is the P91 significantly brighter than the IMR-9? How do their beam patterns compare? From what I hear, the IMR-9 is pretty floody. Also - is the P91 overdriven on 2xIMRs?
Yep. it will be orverdriven. IMR-9 and P91 are a bit similar, but the P91 is brighter.

Actually, I was seriously considering the FM d26 bi-pin adapter - but from the looks of the sales thread, it's no longer available. If it is, I'd love to have it with the WA1111. Is the adapter available anywhere?
The FM D26 adapter to G4 bulbs [IE WA1111] is sold out, but the G2 version [IE FM1794] is still in stock.

Look these threads:
[URL="https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/213022"][/URL]
FM1794 w/ FM D26 G2 by Rich
https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/213022

FM D26 G2 sales thread:
https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/190833

Cheers,
Dioni
 

FlashKat

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Re: Suggestion for incan pocket rocket - Perhaps SolarforceL2+LumensFactory IMR-9?

I found this out using the FM26 G4 with a 1185 running in my Surefire 6P with a Solarforce adapter powered by 3 IMR16340 batteries. I still like it alot.
Huge throw with a 26mm reflector is virtually impossible. All these extreme-high output P60 lamp assemblies are all pretty darn floody with limited throw.
 

hoongern

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Re: Suggestion for incan pocket rocket - Perhaps SolarforceL2+LumensFactory IMR-9?

Due to cost issues and lack of international shipping on some items, I am considering getting a Seraph SP-6 instead, with the built in SR-6/D26 for my low output needs, and an IMR-9 on 2xIMR16340s for high output.

How would this be? And to confirm - would the SR-6 (6volts) not instaflash on 2 LiCo/LiMn 16340s? (I don't use 123 primaries)

Surefires are just too expensive here in Malaysia (unless there are cheap sources I don't know about) and I can't seem to find any Solarforce dealers which ship here without choking up high prices, and I won't be going to the US for a couple months.

From looking at beamshots: https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/235143 it actually seems that these LAs are a LOT throwier than I expected (even from what everyone has been saying about them being floody).

Is there any way to make a D26 _really_ floody?
 

nfetterly

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Re: Suggestion for incan pocket rocket - Perhaps SolarforceL2+LumensFactory IMR-9?

Surprising amount of throw (P91 / FM1794 / WA1185 (FM Sunspot))

My favorite incans are;
P91 in Surefire 6P (2 x IMR 16340s) (posted a WTB P91s and picked up ~6)
FM1794 in FM holder (run this in a FM 2x18650 ("12P")
WA1185 in FM Sunspot (run in Leef 3x18650)

I use AW 3-level soft starts in all three. Obviously this will help lessen insta-flashing, but it's an expensive (~$50) solution.

This thread reminded me - I really need to do a beamshot comparison of the P91 & FM1794 - from memory I would say the FM1794 is more impressive.

The Leef 3x18650 is a bit on the long side, suppose I could run it in a 9P - but I often use it when a co-worker takes out his magcharger - makes my 3x18650 look small at that point!


Nite was selling FM bodies - and I think whole packages (bezel & tail) - not sure if he ships overseas - great to work with.
He also has a deal setup where he special ordered the FM1794 bulbs from Carley (I got 10).
 
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Dioni

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Re: Suggestion for incan pocket rocket - Perhaps SolarforceL2+LumensFactory IMR-9?

Talking a little more about pocket rocket, I decided to post some pics.

Size comparisson
L to R: SF 6P, FM 3P, SF E2E, SF E1E with VME Head
[by Mr. Black]

6P%20vs%20E2e.jpg


Beamshots comparisson
[I dont remember who posted it] :candle:
p1-Surefire-E2E-%28LF-IMR-E2%29.jpg



p1-Surefire-G2-%28P91%29.jpg



E2e really seems to be unbeatable as poket rocket.
I know the OP does not want to spend much, but I thought would be interesting to compare.

Cheers,
Dioni
 

325addict

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Re: Suggestion for incan pocket rocket - Perhaps SolarforceL2+LumensFactory IMR-9?

I have another solution - take a C2 Centurion, add a "Sun"-module by FiveMega with a WA1111 in it and take, indeed, 2X IMR 16340.
Success guaranteed, with over 3 Amps of current :devil:

Runtime will be very, very short though. Less than 10 minutes!


Timmo.
 

hoongern

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Re: Suggestion for incan pocket rocket - Perhaps SolarforceL2+LumensFactory IMR-9?


Beamshots comparisson
[I dont remember who posted it] :candle:

E2e really seems to be unbeatable as poket rocket.
I know the OP does not want to spend much, but I thought would be interesting to compare.

Cheers,
Dioni

I bookmarked those beamshots a while back - they came from here: http://superfonarik.ru/article_info.php?articles_id=11 =) Pretty good stuff.

I guess I can define 'pocket' for me as 6p-sized. I'm actually a bit concerned about heat, running these halogens at high temps in a tropical country is something I'm not too sure about. But I doubt that I'd use it for prolonged periods - for that I'd switch to a LOLA or LED. The E2e does look pretty awesome though - great flood as well!


I have another solution - take a C2 Centurion, add a "Sun"-module by FiveMega with a WA1111 in it and take, indeed, 2X IMR 16340.
Success guaranteed, with over 3 Amps of current :devil:

Runtime will be very, very short though. Less than 10 minutes!


Timmo.

So, after doing more research, I'm more and more undecided.

Body/Host (other suggestions welcome):
- Surefire is unfortunately out for now. They're hugely overpriced where I am.
- Seraph SP-6: Easiest for me. How's the lens on this? Does it hold up to the heat? Also - Does anyone know the current ratings for the twisty tailcap? I'll probably use the twisty as it's more reliable at high currents than the clicky.
- Solarforce L2: How does this compare with the Seraph? Would the tailcap be able to take the high currents of 3-4amps?

Drop-in/bulbs [I DO NOT have a soft-start switch]:
- Still considering the IMR-9 (straightforward), but now leaning towards the FM26 adapter.
- Bulbs: I got an offer on some first-run FM1794 bulbs, and these look tempting - however, it seems that Carley is going to be making these with improved nickel leads - does anyone know how long it will take before these are available? Or are there any similar bulbs for 7-8V usage?
- I'm considering using an extender with the WA1185 as those bulbs seem pretty cheap & effective. How much extra performance would I get from these? (According to Luxluther's tests, 1794: [email protected], 1185: [email protected])
- Other than Nite (FM1794) and Litho (WA1185/WA1111), who else around here sells bi-pin halogens?

Hope that's not too many questions! Also, if I have to, I may wait off on my purchases until I can save up a bit more $.
 

Linger

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Re: Suggestion for incan pocket rocket - Perhaps SolarforceL2+LumensFactory IMR-9?

Hoongern,
You said budget $50-60. For ~$15 on marketplace you can get a SF p91.
2x 16340 IMR cells
Solarforce L2 (or Sereph) host
The tailcaps will work for P91, I have used this set-up.

--Stop there. Get that, try it out. You don't need to buy everything right now. This set-up works with any p60 drop-in, so there are 50 thousand LED options you can use in it too. So you're not really out anything (infact I suggest you do use p60 format for leds as its so easy to customize/modernize.) This set-up also works for many many great incan options. You posted that you wanted to try and incan, get a P91 and smile. If after 1 month you've used it so much you've burnt out the bulb, maybe you like incans and you can get some more. Otherwise you're spending $500 dollars for a shelf-queen and you keep EDC'ing your Quark. Forget 'lola' or anything else. You've already got 3 led lights in your pocket if you need longer run time. Get a solid incan performer (the p91) use it well, only you can determine how it integrates with your light usage patterns.

More flood is a few buck on a dx G&P 9v bulb. Avoid 6v bulbs unless you're using SLA batteries. Do use 4.2v, 9.0v:
https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/228965
https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/161536


You can't use bi-pin bulbs with-out a custom holder (From FiveMega or used resale, $30-35 plus shipping). Recognizing different bulbs by the beam-pattern is the super user level. You're just starting out. Will any noobie feel the differences between an EO-9, P91, WA 1111, .... ? Pick up something cheap from the market place and give it a shot first. You've the rest of your life to spend more money.
halogen bulbs need heat, and with the amount they generate ambient temp isn't a big factor. however you do want to keep the batteries from getting too hot (i don't know if this is concern for SF e series on extended run or not)

!when you get to bi-pin bulbs, and cell extenders, you are over the 3amp limit of your tail-cap. Then you burn out the clicky (I burnt out my tailcap the night I got my FMSunlight+1111) Then you need to make your own clickies and thermistor // or // ~$20-50 for custom made clicky // or // $50 AW soft-start. Then you're putting out too much heat and need to replace lens. Then you're looking for limited or custom run bulbs...
Remember people here are uber incan. They suggest more $ in modifications than you need to spend for your first budget incan rocket ($15 bulb, $20 host, $12 cells). You just wanted to try incan, remember to put the paypal down and take a few minutes to savour your purchase.

!High pressure bulbs - use eye protection when-ever they are exposed! The first time I blew a bi-pin in my [email protected] hotwire I thought we need to get rid of the 'poof' icon because there is nothing gentle when a high pressure halogen bulb explodes and glass shard fly. I was safe because the explosion was contained by the borofloat lens and solid metal cam/camless reflector. !read up on safe handling!
 
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hoongern

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Re: Suggestion for incan pocket rocket - Perhaps SolarforceL2+LumensFactory IMR-9?

Hoongern,
You said budget $50-60. For ~$15 on marketplace you can get a SF p91.
2x 16340 IMR cells
Solarforce L2 (or Sereph) host
The tailcaps will work for P91, I have used this set-up.

--Stop there. Get that, try it out. You don't need to buy everything right now. This set-up works with any p60 drop-in, so there are 50 thousand LED options you can use in it too. So you're not really out anything (infact I suggest you do use p60 format for leds as its so easy to customize/modernize.) This set-up also works for many many great incan options. You posted that you wanted to try and incan, get a P91 and smile. If after 1 month you've used it so much you've burnt out the bulb, maybe you like incans and you can get some more. Otherwise you're spending $500 dollars for a shelf-queen and you keep EDC'ing your Quark. Forget 'lola' or anything else. You've already got 3 led lights in your pocket if you need longer run time. Get a solid incan performer (the p91) use it well, only you can determine how it integrates with your light usage patterns.

More flood is a few buck on a dx G&P 9v bulb. Avoid 6v bulbs unless you're using SLA batteries. 4.2v, 9.0v
https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/228965
https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/161536


You can't use bi-pin bulbs with-out a custom holder (From FiveMega or used resale, $30-35 plus shipping). Recognizing different bulbs by the beam-pattern is the super user level. You're just starting out. Will any noobie feel the differences between an EO-9, P91, WA 1111, .... ? Pick up something cheap from the market place and give it a shot first. You've the rest of your life to spend more money.
halogen bulbs need heat, and with the amount they generate ambient temp isn't a big factor. however you do want to keep the batteries from getting too hot (i don't know if this is concern for SF e series on extended run or not)

!when you get to bi-pin bulbs, and cell extenders, you are over the 3amp limit of your tail-cap. Then you burn out the clicky (I burnt out my tailcap the night I got my FMSunlight+1111) Then you need to make your own clickies and thermistor // or // ~$20-50 for custom made clicky // or // $50 AW soft-start. Then you're putting out too much heat and need to replace lens. Then you're looking for limited or custom run bulbs...
Remember people here are uber incan. They suggest more $ in modifications than you need to spend for your first budget incan rocket ($15 bulb, $20 host, $12 cells). You just wanted to try incan, remember to put the paypal down and take a few minutes to savour your purchase.

!High pressure bulbs - use eye protection when-ever they are exposed! The first time I blew a bi-pin in my [email protected] hotwire I thought we need to get rid of the 'poof' icon because there is nothing gentle when a high pressure halogen bulb explodes and glass shard fly. I was safe because the explosion was contained by the borofloat lens and solid metal cam/camless reflector. !read up on safe handling!

Hey Linger,

Thanks for your post. You actually made some good points, many of which I had realized shortly after my previous post, and that you reinforced.

For a first incan, I'm probably just going to go with the Seraph SP-6 and [if I can find one] P91, otherwise the IMR-9. As you said - if I don't like it, I can always slap in some LED drop-in.

If I like it, I may either get a FM G4/D26, or perhaps also try out the D36 line (of course, no longer being pocket rockets)

But one thing I'll say - beam patterns have made a big influence on my purchases so far (Esp my move to smoother XP-Es - my LF2XT and Quark) and I have been looking for something floody (thought of using a bigger bulb in a D26/shallow reflector) - so assuming the same applies to LEDs and incans with beam patters, I'm sure I'd appreciate a good beam, depending on what I wanted =) Maybe I'm mistaken? But anyway, thanks for all the solid advice. I definitely have read up on those exploding 1794s and melted clickies / shorted IMRs. Sounds scary!
 

ampdude

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Re: Suggestion for incan pocket rocket - Perhaps SolarforceL2+LumensFactory IMR-9?

How much current does the IMR-E2 drain off of a freshly charged pair of IMR cells?
 

ampdude

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Re: Suggestion for incan pocket rocket - Perhaps SolarforceL2+LumensFactory IMR-9?

Oh good, you could still run it off of primaries then if you had to.
 
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