Which Malkoff drop-in?
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Kestrel
Flashaholic
Hey there, :wave:
The M61W is definitely the ticket IMO. There is a massive M61 thread here, but the best info is near the end (with actual user feedback). For lack of a better idea I'd suggest starting on pg 45 and reading backward.
Unfortunately that thread is so long that it has lost its utility unless you use the "search this thread" function at the bottom of any page in it.
I have an M31W (for 2xAA in the three-cell SF's) and really like it. However, for 2xCR123 or one LiIon rechargeable in your M2, I think that the M61W would work very well for you. :thumbsup:
The M61W is definitely the ticket IMO. There is a massive M61 thread here, but the best info is near the end (with actual user feedback). For lack of a better idea I'd suggest starting on pg 45 and reading backward.
Unfortunately that thread is so long that it has lost its utility unless you use the "search this thread" function at the bottom of any page in it.
I have an M31W (for 2xAA in the three-cell SF's) and really like it. However, for 2xCR123 or one LiIon rechargeable in your M2, I think that the M61W would work very well for you. :thumbsup:
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pwatcher
Enlightened
For personal defense, neutral is better than warm (brighter in BG's eyes).
So the M61 would be a little better than the M61W I think.
For general, around the house duty, either would be great as they are more efficient than the earlier generation M60's, but the M61W would have better color rendition outdoors. I have both, and don't think you can go wrong with either when it gets down to it.
GL!
So the M61 would be a little better than the M61W I think.
For general, around the house duty, either would be great as they are more efficient than the earlier generation M60's, but the M61W would have better color rendition outdoors. I have both, and don't think you can go wrong with either when it gets down to it.
GL!
etc
Flashlight Enthusiast
I am waiting for M61WLL.
prof student
Enlightened
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- Nov 14, 2007
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- 373
General use around the house calls for something totally different than for personal defense use.
General use around the house usually means not needing to light up anything at a great distance. If its too bright, it would actually hinder your eyesight indoors. MANY LEO here say when they do indoor sweeps, 80 lumens is more than enough, because anything brighter bouncing off the wall or reflective surfaces actually blinds them. According to Gene's website here http://www.malkoffdevices.com/compare-flashlights.php, look at the run times. The 60LL gives awesome runtimes. The 60WL isn't bad either. If you are using primaries, either one gives great output for INDOOR general use and long runtime, especially when using primarie$s, lol.
For defense, brighter is better, right? Blind them with light...can light up at a great distance so you can see it earlier, etc...Now it just depends on what tint you want. Between the M61 & M61W, same runtime, and only a 40 lumens difference.
General use around the house usually means not needing to light up anything at a great distance. If its too bright, it would actually hinder your eyesight indoors. MANY LEO here say when they do indoor sweeps, 80 lumens is more than enough, because anything brighter bouncing off the wall or reflective surfaces actually blinds them. According to Gene's website here http://www.malkoffdevices.com/compare-flashlights.php, look at the run times. The 60LL gives awesome runtimes. The 60WL isn't bad either. If you are using primaries, either one gives great output for INDOOR general use and long runtime, especially when using primarie$s, lol.
For defense, brighter is better, right? Blind them with light...can light up at a great distance so you can see it earlier, etc...Now it just depends on what tint you want. Between the M61 & M61W, same runtime, and only a 40 lumens difference.
prof student
Enlightened
- Joined
- Nov 14, 2007
- Messages
- 373
Kestrel
Flashaholic
They are like potato chips. No one is happy with just one.
Just my $.02
Just my $.02
Sparky's Magic
Enlightened
The M61 is quite floody - in fact, more so than most and should suit your requirements
perfectly. In a MD2 setup there is also the hi/low option which gives a very useable
40 or so lumens on low with RCR's and 20 or so lumens with an 18650 cell.
perfectly. In a MD2 setup there is also the hi/low option which gives a very useable
40 or so lumens on low with RCR's and 20 or so lumens with an 18650 cell.
JJay03
Newly Enlightened
Im also looking for another malkoff drop in and would like to see some beam shots of the m61 vs the m60 is there any on here I can not find any? Wait I found some on youtube it looks nice!
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etc
Flashlight Enthusiast
There are plenty floating around here. Just do a google search, like this:
I have both the older M60 and the newer M61.
M61 is more useful about 80% of the time.
Actually considering that M61 is more tuned to run on 1x18650 without losing any lumens, for me, it's the module of choice about 90% of the time for this reason. M60 will also run on 1x18650 but not at full lumens. M60 however plays really well with 2x18650.
Code:
site:candlepowerforums.com M61 M60 picsI have both the older M60 and the newer M61.
M61 is more useful about 80% of the time.
Actually considering that M61 is more tuned to run on 1x18650 without losing any lumens, for me, it's the module of choice about 90% of the time for this reason. M60 will also run on 1x18650 but not at full lumens. M60 however plays really well with 2x18650.
tandem
Enlightened
Somewhere along the lines of reading a few thousand posts on Malkoff drop ins, MD2 and Surefire bodies I thought I'd seen the info I am searching for but haven't been able to unearth it again. Re-reading posts and viewing the pretty pictures again has been enjoyable enough but I'm starting to feel like I'm travelling in circles, and am probably single handedly responsible for slowing down the CPF server! Begging the forum's indulgence, could anyone pop by and help me with a few queries?
I really like the beamshots I see of Malkoff drop ins - I'm not looking for a big thrower but instead a beam with a bigger than smaller hotspot that dissolves nicely into bright spill and it seems the M61 is a good fit. The light will be used for general purpose use but also ideally will be suitable for extended night cycling (assuming the output-runtime picture on 18650's looks applicable).
The condensed form of the questions are:
Can I get > 150 lumen for > 2 hours off a single 2400mAh or 2600mAh AW 18650? (If the answer is no, then it likely doesn't make any sense for me to travel this road at all! Edit: I guess this theoretical post from Kestrel may go to answering my question but would love some confirmation.)
The longer form:
1. I frequently see output tests for the first second, ten seconds and later. I'm much more interested in what the output is after the module has been running continuously for 10 minutes, 30 minutes, 90 minutes and more, so a chart would be invaluable. Anyone done one?
Is it realistic to run an M61 continuously off a AW 18650 cell in a body/bezel like the MD2 or bored out SureFire C2/6P? Would you feel comfortable doing so, repeatedly replacing cells as needed, all night long? Wondering about heat...
2. Has anyone done an output-runtime chart for the M61 running on different cell configurations? I'm really interested in the "bright enough" component of the output trace on an 18650. Gene's site only lists runtimes for primaries. I understand that as the 18650 cell drops in voltage eventually the M61 will fall out of regulation and enter direct drive.
How long is that period of regulation? And how much longer will the output remain > 200 lumen? > 170 lumen? > 130 lumen? > 100 lumen? Even rough guesses on only a couple output levels would be really helpful to me.
I really like the beamshots I see of Malkoff drop ins - I'm not looking for a big thrower but instead a beam with a bigger than smaller hotspot that dissolves nicely into bright spill and it seems the M61 is a good fit. The light will be used for general purpose use but also ideally will be suitable for extended night cycling (assuming the output-runtime picture on 18650's looks applicable).
The condensed form of the questions are:
Can I get > 150 lumen for > 2 hours off a single 2400mAh or 2600mAh AW 18650? (If the answer is no, then it likely doesn't make any sense for me to travel this road at all! Edit: I guess this theoretical post from Kestrel may go to answering my question but would love some confirmation.)
The longer form:
1. I frequently see output tests for the first second, ten seconds and later. I'm much more interested in what the output is after the module has been running continuously for 10 minutes, 30 minutes, 90 minutes and more, so a chart would be invaluable. Anyone done one?
Is it realistic to run an M61 continuously off a AW 18650 cell in a body/bezel like the MD2 or bored out SureFire C2/6P? Would you feel comfortable doing so, repeatedly replacing cells as needed, all night long? Wondering about heat...
2. Has anyone done an output-runtime chart for the M61 running on different cell configurations? I'm really interested in the "bright enough" component of the output trace on an 18650. Gene's site only lists runtimes for primaries. I understand that as the 18650 cell drops in voltage eventually the M61 will fall out of regulation and enter direct drive.
How long is that period of regulation? And how much longer will the output remain > 200 lumen? > 170 lumen? > 130 lumen? > 100 lumen? Even rough guesses on only a couple output levels would be really helpful to me.
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Kestrel
Flashaholic
I think a very good runtime estimate for the M61 on a 2600 mAh AW 18650 would be 2 - 2.5 hrs, but you raise a good question with regards to the runtime in regulation vs the additional usable runtime during declining output. I'm confident in my theoretical calculation comparisons in the post of mine that you cite, except that was for a theoretical drain rate that is about twice that of the M61. There shouldn't be much deviation at the ~3.5 - 4 W drain rate of the M61 - the bottom line is that the AW 18650 can provide about ~75% more watt hours than 2x CR123 for most reasonable drain rates - this should provide you the runtime you need.
With regards to heat, I would have no hesistation whatsover with doing full back-to-back runs with the M61 in an aluminum bezel. By all reports, the generated heat is quite manageable, and IMO Gene Malkoff is one of of the more conservative drop-in module designers.
I do think that the single large cell would be a very good choice, providing extended runtime with gradually declining output.
I can't recall seeing an output / runtime graph for the M61 on 1x 18650 here on CPF but it would be very good data to have. We aren't seeing these posted as often as they used to be here.
----------
More user reports would be very welcome with regards to how the M61 performs after 2+ hours on 1x 18650.
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tandem
Enlightened
Thanks for the feedback Kestrel. I'd started out this journey hoping that maybe the M31 on 2xAA could be used but I think I'd be carrying too many cells on distance rides.
Just to confirm my understanding then, are you asserting that the M61 should deliver regulated output (at or close 'nuff to rated output) for about 2 hours off of a 2600 mAh AW 18650 before entering its gradual decline phase?
If so then that's a winner for me. 4 - 5 cells for an entire night of distance riding. That'll probably prove to be a conservative estimate except in the dead of winter here, given that some of the declining output curve will be perfectly usable, and accounting for dawn and dusk and mandatory rest periods.
A chart would be really helpful in determining if one such 18650 could power my wife's daily bike commute to and from work for a week as I suspect it could.
Now to decide what host(s) to put it in, and what credit card to hide the purchase on.
-- Mike
Just to confirm my understanding then, are you asserting that the M61 should deliver regulated output (at or close 'nuff to rated output) for about 2 hours off of a 2600 mAh AW 18650 before entering its gradual decline phase?
If so then that's a winner for me. 4 - 5 cells for an entire night of distance riding. That'll probably prove to be a conservative estimate except in the dead of winter here, given that some of the declining output curve will be perfectly usable, and accounting for dawn and dusk and mandatory rest periods.
A chart would be really helpful in determining if one such 18650 could power my wife's daily bike commute to and from work for a week as I suspect it could.
Now to decide what host(s) to put it in, and what credit card to hide the purchase on.
-- Mike
Yesterday I ordered a C2L, my first Surefire. I'm pretty sure I will think it is to cool/blue since I usually like neutral white lights and therefore I will probably get a drop-in for it.
How warm is the M61W / M61WL and how cool is the M61 / M61L?
To give you an idea of my preferences I can tell you this:
The Fenix TK20, ET P20C2 NW and Quark mini123 NW has a nice tint, the little cooler (but still neutral) LD40 even better in this case IMO.
I'm not that fond of cool white but my Streamlight PolyTac LED is OK.
I don't want anything close to the Quark ww this time.
Can anybody tell me how the Malkoff drop-ins are compared to those other lights above?
How warm is the M61W / M61WL and how cool is the M61 / M61L?
To give you an idea of my preferences I can tell you this:
The Fenix TK20, ET P20C2 NW and Quark mini123 NW has a nice tint, the little cooler (but still neutral) LD40 even better in this case IMO.
I'm not that fond of cool white but my Streamlight PolyTac LED is OK.
I don't want anything close to the Quark ww this time.
Can anybody tell me how the Malkoff drop-ins are compared to those other lights above?
tandem
Enlightened
We seem to be travelling in similar circles Gunnar, or is that bi-cyles? I like your LD40 and LD25 outdoor beamshots but bet that the M61 will put them to shame.
So far I've been willing to trade colour for some output and/or runtime and assumed the M61 is the right one for me but will eat some popcorn and see what happens in response to your question.
Post 63 in this thread is descriptive:
(edit: perhaps also view/read post 110 / 113 in that thread. My Fenix light lottery winnings delivered me slightly greenish lights and I find I like them much more than blue tints)
Guess I need to watch this space carefully. I'd discounted the M61W because of beam shots I'd seen of the M60W which looked very very warm to me. I'm attracted to neutral to ever so slightly warm (but would rather lean to cool if fearful of a light being too warm).
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Kestrel
Flashaholic
- The M60W was rather warm - 4000K IIRC?
- The first runs of the M61W were actually neutral - 5000K. Perfect for my tastes.
- Gene M has posted that he is changing the emitter in the M61W to 4000K. This will unfortunately cause yet more confusion IMO if this substitution is done 'in line', with no product differentiation.
Edit:
From this post,
I'm glad I already have my 5000K M31W, it's going to be a toss-up as to what color temps we're going to get on the used market now. :sigh:
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tandem
Enlightened
Gene M has posted that he is changing the emitter in the M61W to 4000K. This will unfortunately cause yet more confusion IMO if this substitution is done 'in line', with no product differentiation.
Conclusion, buy an M61W quickly, before it gets too warm.
You beat me to it -- I'd just read your comment within the other thread on the M61W emitter change and was coming back to update the thread. M61W "Neutral" it is for me then, before it is too late... 4000K is way too warm for my taste.
