1000 lumen HDS

[aginthelaw]

If someone has a zl in one pocket and hds in another and gets hit by a train I know which one will be sent to their next of kin. WOW. I really should get checked for ptsd.

 

[WalkIntoTheLight]

Wow, I gotta hand it to the OP, he trolled it out-of-the-park with this one!

 

[RCS1300]

What is the resale value of a Zebralight SC64 after 6 months?

If a friend was going to give you a free flashlight and gave you a choice of a HDS flashlight or a Zebralight SC64, which one would you take?

I thought about doing a shootout between the SC64 and the HDS. So, I read about the SC64 and realized I would never own one of these $79 flashlights. As a result, I have no interest in doing the comparison.

 

[Tejasandre]

I consistently see zebra sell for retail or close here.

 

[bigburly912]

I consistently see zebra sell for retail or close here.

Yep. Almost always 80-90%. I don't know why I have never owned a zebra light but maybe I should give them a chance.

 

[Tejasandre]

If you need a headlight, for now, it's the way to go.

 

[CREEXHP70LED]

Sorry, short attention span. Do I understand that you carry your G19 in your pocket? If so, that's awesome. Any photos of your gear would be welcome.

Back on topic. The SF P3X and the Elzetta Charlie are top tier flashlights. I don't know of anyone who would dispute that. However, it's an apples and oranges comparison with the HDS, since the latter runs on one battery while the SF and Elzetta require three. Granted, the OP was about luminosity rather than efficiency or form factor. Or maybe I'm captain obvious this afternoon.

Yes, you are captain obvious. I carry all three everyday, all at once captain obvious. I carry in my left pocket my light. In my right pocket my knife and my pistol at 4-5 O'clock wanna see it ???

Oh and yes, sometimes I do carry a G19 or a G29 in my pocket. I wear 5.11 or similar pants everyday.

 

[CREEXHP70LED]

To this flashaholic EDC means portability first. Brute force comes in at least second, maybe 3rd behind reliability. Guaranteed reliability. These days a one cell light can do a lot more than not that long ago and still be reliable.

Also to me EDC tops out around 600-700 lumens based on again, portability and reliability. 2 fuel cells can easily do that and the body still be fairly portable. I'd rather have a well driven, steady output with a few hundred less lumens than something over driven since it could quite possibly be reducing the life span of the emitter enough to put doubt in my brain about reliabilty.

I cannot speak from experience about either HDS or Zebralight actually. But if I were the sort who preferred Mercedes over my Ford I'd have a few HDS lights long before a single Zebralight. Nothing against Zebralight mind-you. Hell I still think the 3 watt Luxeon was the best LED with XPG-2 a close second.

Get a Lexus, more reliable, and if you have the money much faster.

 

[CREEXHP70LED]

When cost is a factor people make trade offs and then rationalize their decision. When cost is not a factor people look for the best product to meet their needs. Unfortunately, it is that simple. Then, it gets down to what percentage of the population has $300-$400 to spend on one flashlight. That percentage is very, very small.

Once you go HDS, everything else looks like a compromise with no future resale value. With one or more HDS lights in hand, you will also need to purchase a thrower and a very small key chain pocket light. Unfortunately, Henry is not making these...yet.

Very true, some of us want to see what is coming 300 yards away.

 

[CREEXHP70LED]

The candle mode is the only thing o really miss. Nothing like drinking a few beers and turning the candle on after a long day haha.

In my case a few beers and 2 bottles of wine. LOL...........Think I am kidding....

 

[CREEXHP70LED]

I agree that HDS lights are still ahead of the curve technology-wise. My HDS 140 from 2012 is still more than viable, and I've yet to find a superior clicky-based programmable flashlight.

As for design stagnation, I think that's somewhat inevitable given just how good the design of the Rotary already is. The Rotary is still the quintessential apex of functionality and convenience in terms of UIs. The Cool Fall Spy uses a similar UI, but that's in a whole another league.

Speaking candidly, I've never had a need for more output than my Rotary (200 lumens) could put out. I had an Emisar D4, which was a sweet light, but I couldn't fathom ever using the 3000 lumen setting in practical use, save showing off. Maybe my experience is just the result of my usage habits, but that's my 2 cents.

I have never showed off my D4 to a single person except my brother in law who came over insisting to see it. I use it as protection and awareness.

 

[Fireclaw18]

Flashlights are consumer electronics. They're not stock or jewelry or bricks of gold.

I buy a flashlight so I can use it and light things up. I know technology is advancing rapidly and am eager to have the coolest most advanced lights available. How well the flashlight will hold "resale value" is completely irrelevant to me. It's consumer electronics. I don't care about how well my desktop computer will hold its resale value in 5 years and the same applies to my lights.

HDS is dated technology. Lots of lights have good UIs that allow instant access to min and max, and quick access to intermediate modes. As long as the UI meets those criteria its good enough for me.

The best UI I've seen on a light is the older model Jetbeam RRT-01 and TCR-01: The only control is a rotary ring with 120 degrees of travel. Left is off, right is max. Rotate in between for infinitely variable dimming. Can get to any setting from off in about a 1/4 second. And unlike an HDS, the rotary control is in a more convenient position near the front of the light so you don't have to hold it in an awkward overhead grip, or flip your hand around after turning it on.

Those Jetbeams have great UIs... but I still don't EDC them anymore. Why? ... the output at 500 lumens is simply too low. I've been spoiled by Zebras and multi-thousand lumen triples and quads. 500 lumens max just doesn't cut it anymore. And HDS is even worse. I couldn't imagine carrying around a light that only outputs 300 lumens, especially when it's larger than my 4000 lumen lights.

A similar comparison can be found with TVs: If all you've known is low resolution non-HD you're fine with it. But once you experience the quality of HD, or even better 4K... you don't ever want to go back.

Technology wise, what has advanced since the Rotary came out?
- more advanced LEDs are available (Oslon flat for throw, Cree XHP 50.2 for max lumens in 3v, LH351D and SST20 for extremely high CRI, etc.).
- it is now standard on many lights to use a larger microprocessor than was used 5 years ago (Atiny85 v. Atiny13a). This allows for a more advanced UI and feature set than was common back then.
- temp sensors with automatic rampdown and rampup are now standard even on budget lights. Timed stepdowns have gone out of favor. Not needed for an HDS since ouptut is so low heat isn't an issue.
- more advanced li-ion cells are available, such as the 1100 mAh 18350 or high powered 18650s. A CR123 powered HDS isn't able to take advantage of these advances in battery technology.
- one button UIs are more refined than they were 5 years, narrowing the advantage rotary controls had (Anduril and Narsil UI, the newer programmable Zebralight UI, etc.)
- compact triple and quad led setups are now common. Multiple LED setups can produce far more lumens than most comparable single LED confgurations.

 

[CREEXHP70LED]

One sec

 

[Fireclaw18]

If someone has a zl in one pocket and hds in another and gets hit by a train I know which one will be sent to their next of kin. WOW. I really should get checked for ptsd.

If your only criteria is max toughness and reliability... then yes, HDS beats Zebralight.

However, when deciding what light to purchase, most of us probably do not ask ourselves the "If I get hit by a train" question.

 

[CREEXHP70LED]

Flashlights are consumer electronics. They're not stock or jewelry or bricks of gold.

I buy a flashlight so I can use it and light things up. I know technology is advancing rapidly and am eager to have the coolest most advanced lights available. How well the flashlight will hold "resale value" is completely irrelevant to me. It's consumer electronics. I don't care about how well my desktop computer will hold its resale value in 5 years and the same applies to my lights.

HDS is dated technology. Lots of lights have good UIs that allow instant access to min and max, and quick access to intermediate modes. As long as the UI meets those criteria its good enough for me.

The best UI I've seen on a light is the older model Jetbeam RRT-01 and TCR-01: The only control is a rotary ring with 120 degrees of travel. Left is off, right is max. Rotate in between for infinitely variable dimming. Can get to any setting from off in about a 1/4 second. And unlike an HDS, the rotary control is in a more convenient position near the front of the light so you don't have to hold it in an awkward overhead grip, or flip your hand around after turning it on.

Those Jetbeams have great UIs... but I still don't EDC them anymore. Why? ... the output at 500 lumens is simply too low. I've been spoiled by Zebras and multi-thousand lumen triples and quads. 500 lumens max just doesn't cut it anymore. And HDS is even worse. I couldn't imagine carrying around a light that only outputs 300 lumens, especially when it's larger than my 4000 lumen lights. I do own may Surefires just not any Elzettas yet.

A similar comparison can be found with TVs: If all you've known is low resolution non-HD you're fine with it. But once you experience the quality of HD, or even better 4K... you don't ever want to go back.

Technology wise, what has advanced since the Rotary came out?
- more advanced LEDs are available (Oslon flat for throw, Cree XHP 50.2 for max lumens in 3v, LH351D and SST20 for extremely high CRI, etc.).
- it is now standard on many lights to use a larger microprocessor than was used 5 years ago (Atiny85 v. Atiny13a). This allows for a more advanced UI and feature set than was common back then.
- temp sensors with automatic rampdown and rampup are now standard even on budget lights. Timed stepdowns have gone out of favor. Not needed for an HDS since ouptut is so low heat isn't an issue.
- more advanced li-ion cells are available, such as the 1100 mAh 18350 or high powered 18650s. A CR123 powered HDS isn't able to take advantage of these advances in battery technology.
- one button UIs are more refined than they were 5 years, narrowing the advantage rotary controls had (Anduril and Narsil UI, the newer programmable Zebralight UI, etc.)
- compact triple and quad led setups are now common. Multiple LED setups can produce far more lumens than most comparable single LED confgurations.

Very nicely said my friend. I like talking to my Sony Bravia big screen remote rather than typing what I want. I do like a few lights that are tech proof though like some Surefires and Elzettas that I have yet to even own, yet I defend them. They seem to be hack proof. LOL. I do own many Surefire just no Elzettas yet. Soon to change.

 

[CREEXHP70LED]

Sorry, short attention span. Do I understand that you carry your G19 in your pocket? If so, that's awesome. Any photos of your gear would be welcome.

Back on topic. The SF P3X and the Elzetta Charlie are top tier flashlights. I don't know of anyone who would dispute that. However, it's an apples and oranges comparison with the HDS, since the latter runs on one battery while the SF and Elzetta require three. Granted, the OP was about luminosity rather than efficiency or form factor. Or maybe I'm captain obvious this afternoon.

I have 4 pictures for you , I just can't seem to post them for some reason, I am a different kind of operator. LOL

 

[Dirty wage guy]

I can't agree more that a zebralight headlight is the s#!t, but that just tells me that other makers are so missing a whole nother market that has been ready to tap into for so long. I'd love to see say an HDS headlamp, or perhaps someone like Jeff from Okluma coming up with a 90 degree light. I know he'd come up with something that would make all of us put our beloved zebralight headlights in a drawer..

what in the hell is a zebralight anyway and does anyone know why, or how they came up with that weird *** name for a flashlight company?

 

[StarHalo]

I have 4 pictures for you , I just can't seem to post them for some reason, I am a different kind of operator. LOL

Upload to Imgur, under "Get share links", copy the "BBCode (Forums)" link, paste in your text here.

 

[RCS1300]

Very true, some of us want to see what is coming 300 yards away.

I do not know about 300 yards. We have a weekend house, where I am now, and have a family of bears living about 125 yards away in the woods. My HDS light is not powerful enough to help me spot the bears when they are 100 yards, my preferred safety distance, away from me. For that purpose I purchased a Thrunite Catapult. With the Catapult I can see the reflection of the eyes of any animal at 100 yards.

 

[RCS1300]

Flashlights are consumer electronics. They're not stock or jewelry or bricks of gold.

I buy a flashlight so I can use it and light things up. I know technology is advancing rapidly and am eager to have the coolest most advanced lights available. How well the flashlight will hold "resale value" is completely irrelevant to me. It's consumer electronics. I don't care about how well my desktop computer will hold its resale value in 5 years and the same applies to my lights.

HDS is dated technology. Lots of lights have good UIs that allow instant access to min and max, and quick access to intermediate modes. As long as the UI meets those criteria its good enough for me.

... the output at 500 lumens is simply too low...I couldn't imagine carrying around a light that only outputs 300 lumens, especially when it's larger than my 4000 lumen lights.


Technology wise, what has advanced since the Rotary came out?
- more advanced LEDs
- a larger microprocessor
- temp sensors with automatic rampdown and rampup are now standard even on budget lights. Timed stepdowns have gone out of favor. Not needed for an HDS since ouptut is so low heat isn't an issue.
- more advanced li-ion cells are available
- one button UIs
- Multiple LED setups can produce far more lumens than most comparable single LED confgurations.

With over 2,100 posts on record, the post above deviates outside of the Archimedes curve. More Lumens, more leds, more choices, oh my. Unfortunately, for an edc light I cannot get excited about any of that. The most advanced edc light around is the HDS.